Clock Oil / Auto Oil argue?

[Paul Faf]

We have all heard the “ hey you change the oil in your car every 3000 miles. Your clock needs the same respect”.

This is an apple orange comparison.

If you want to compare a clock to a rear drive axle going less than 1 Mph with the dust caps off, I’ll buy that. To compare to an explosive internal combustion engines NO!

I just thought I’d light the fuse and I’ll return on Saturday Morning.

 

[shutterbug]

Well, the thing is that either way you've got friction. Oil reduces friction and preserves the parts. If you want to run your 1 MPH rear axle without lubrication, it will eventually bind up. The same thing happens in a clock. The oil accumulates dust, and becomes ineffective. Damage starts to occur and eventually the clocks power will not overcome the friction and will grind to a halt. At that point, the damage will require extensive repair that could have been avoided with a little preventive maintenance

 

[harold bain]

Sorry, Paul, we don't argue here. We merely agree to disagree .
While a car may not be a suitable metaphor, it is one of the few mechanical devices in everyones lives these days that people can identify with lubrication. Lack of lubrication in a clock will not be as dramatic as lack of oil in an internal combustion engine. However, it will cause noticable wear.
Harold

 

[Paul Faf]

Harrold N Bug I don't disagree on lubrication and wear theory.

Harrold I think you hit the nail on head with the word Dramatic. The next time I hear or read that metaphor I'll think Ahh ==Drama person

I fear oversimplification of terms with the public I.E. this comparison could and will lead to a loss of confidence in us with the public.

 

[MARK A. BUTTERWORTH]

If I could offer an observation- oft times the consumer is sold a clock with the understanding that the clock is a heirloom designed to last hundreds of years. In addition, the buyer may have no mechanical experience or aptitude.

Ultimately the repair person is called in when the clock stops and tries to explain (to a cynical customer)that the clock has a movement that is a mechanical device with gears and a power train that has run 24/7 for several years.

Considering that the consumer has no other frame of reference or experience, the comparison to a vehicle that runs maybe a couple of hours a day and still requires periodic maintenance and a possible engine rebuild after a couple hundred thousand miles I think is realistic and fair.

 

[shutterbug]

I fear oversimplification of terms with the public I.E. this comparison could and will lead to a loss of confidence in us with the public.

Well, if the public asks but won't listen to the principle of the argument presented by the experts, what can you say? It reminds me of the story of the Harley mechanic that was repairing the Doctors machine and said " Hey Doc - you and I do basically the same thing. You repair hearts and I repair motorcycles, but it's pretty much the same job. It bugs me that you make hundreds of thousands of dollars a year, and I make less than a hundred in a good year! It does not seem fair to me." The doctor thought for a minute, then smiled and said "OK, I understand what you're saying. Try repairing the bike with the motor running."
Oversimplification still makes the point, no?

 

[Paul Faf]

What got me thinking? A Millwright from a local steel mill brought me a ships bell clock.

After the work was done I explained that a couple of barrings were burned out and needed replacement inserts and the WD 40 on the balance kinda gums the hairspring up.

I didn't want to try the 3000-mile thing for fear he might want me show him where the radiator was.

 

[shutterbug]

Understandable It's always better to examine the clock and make recommendations and quotes before the work is done. No hard feelings that way :0)

 

[Len Lataille]

Mark makes and excellent point and what he says is exactly what I tell my customers. They spend thousands of dollars on a vehicle that they only run a few hours a day, and despite changing the oil on a regular basis, the vehicle will eventually end up in the junkyard.

How many 1955 Fords do you see on the roads? Many of us would keep our cars forever, if they did not become "money pits" or unsafe to drive.
The only major difference is that a clock does not suffer the exposure to the elements.

And that arguement, the good condition of the case,is why I am able to convince most customers that replacing the movement will give them a "new" clock for a lot less money than the price of a new one, made of cheaper materials.

 

[harold bain]

Len. I hope you are referring to swapping a Hermle with a Hermle or a Regula with a Regula type of movement replacing. I wonder what repairmen did 100 years ago when authentic replacement movements were available for American clocks from the manufacturers. Was it ecomonically feasable to repair the common time and strike or were movements replaced?
Harold

 

[Paul Faf]

If I ran my auto for 55hours at 55 Miles per hour = 3025 oil change time.

So I should tare the clock down every 2 and 1/2 days and reoil?

Ok that's stupid!

I should do a RPM compare?

4500RPM X 1 Hour = 270,000RPH 270,000 X 55 hours of drive time = 14,850,000 revolutions for the approximate 3000 mile marker. Ok now we are getting somewhere! Now lets divide to see how many days that clock should last before an oil change. 14850000/24 = 618,750days NO! Can't go that long.

Apple vs. Orange

Brass is softer than Steel.

Steel will run on brass without lubrication if given enough power. I know this through practice at my round bar straighter at the Steel Mill. Will a brass guide or surface last longer with lubrication? Yes with out a doubt. Will it last forever? No. How long then? To many variables to count.

By the way my dads old 55 Ford is a small percentage of my 2005 Chevy.

Americans acquire new cars because we want new cars. If new cars ended tomorrow we would not be riding horses we would be riding in overhauled autos.

For explaining. I think I'll use the "Brass is softer than Steel" The 3000 mile oil change seems like talking down.

You guys are gonna do what you want to do.

At this point we are chasing out tails on this subject. End

 

[ogee_guy]

put oil in that crankcase-- put the open container of kerosene in the clock case so the vapors will lube the clock works forever

 

[TEACLOCKS]

After the kerosene Evaporates is it still a Lubricant??

 

[Weight Driven]

I'm going to put an open container of kerosene under the hood of my car.

 

[fume happy]

Len. I hope you are referring to swapping a Hermle with a Hermle or a Regula with a Regula type of movement replacing. I wonder what repairmen did 100 years ago when authentic replacement movements were available for American clocks from the manufacturers. Was it ecomonically feasable to repair the common time and strike or were movements replaced?
Harold

Harold, I obtained an ingraham black mantel clock recently, where someone had written on the back "New Movement 1917" The clock couldn't have been more than 10 years old at the time.

 

[harold bain]

Fume, I thought this could have happened. If the clock owner tried to repair it himself, and destroyed the movement in the process, the repairman would have little choice but to get a new movement from the manufacturer. Or perhaps this was an economical and easy repair for the clock's owner to do himself. I am sure the manufacturers sold loose movements to anyone who wanted one. Interesting :biggrin:
Harold

 

[shutterbug]

I have on my bench right now a cuckoo hermle movement that has been drenched in WD-40. Thinking I could save myself the hassle and frustration of cleaning it, I offered the customer a new replacement movement at less cost. He said, "No thanks, I want the old one." Go figure