Clock arrived ...shattered. And so am I.

Discussion in 'Clock Repair' started by lynnoliver, Aug 30, 2017.

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  1. lynnoliver

    lynnoliver Registered User

    Aug 30, 2017
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    We ordered a clock. We received shards of glass and a frame. The seller packaged it so poorly, it is amazing the rest isn't worse.

    First question: how do I know what the dial was made of? I've been googling for days now, and some places refer to an enamel dial, some to porcelain, and some to reverse painted glass... which seems to be what ours was. But I'm not sure. It had an old paper backing behind it, and the shards have a thick layer of white that flakes off with the slightest touch.

    Also, the case arrived damaged and a top corner of the movement box (sorry for lack of terminology) is loose enough that I worry it would break if we actually hung it on the wall.

    Is this something worth repairing, or should we just get our money back and start looking for another one? Does anyone know where/how I can get the dial replaced?


    314752.jpg 314753.jpg
     
  2. bruce linde

    bruce linde Technical Admin
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    sorry... we've all had it happen... doesn't make it right.

    get your money back. take lots of pictures and deal with it immediately.
     
  3. Bruce Alexander

    Bruce Alexander Registered User
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    I hate when that happens!

    The dial is probably Porcelain Enamel. The dial could be restored, the glass replaced, the case repaired but in the parlance of an Insurance Adjuster, the clock has probably been "totaled". I agree with Bruce, at this point it's better to recover your money (including any shipping charges you paid *especially* since the Seller didn't bother to pack the clock properly) and look for another clock like or similar to it. Perhaps you'll find something you like better.

    When you do find your next clock, ask questions of the Seller regarding what precautions he or she plans to take prior to shipping. Read over these UPS Packaging Guidelines: https://www.ups.com/cw/en/help-center/packaging-and-supplies/packaging-guidelines.page and make sure the Seller plans to pack to something along those standards. Better luck next time.
     
  4. musicguy

    musicguy Moderator
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    Very sorry to see that.


    Rob
     
  5. novicetimekeeper

    novicetimekeeper Registered User
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    That so annoying when people don't take any care in packing leading to the senseless waste of what looked like an attractive clock.

    Ask for all your money back including postage, they will probably tell you to dispose of the clock, you can have a go at repair but it will never be how you really wanted so buy something you might prefer instead.
     
  6. lynnoliver

    lynnoliver Registered User

    Aug 30, 2017
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    Oh my word, I plan to do this to a fairly intense degree!!
     
  7. lynnoliver

    lynnoliver Registered User

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    Packing material consisted of a small sheet of well-used bubblewrap (smaller than one side of the clock it was intended to protect) and an extremely fragrant bath towel sitting over the front glass.

    :thumbs_down::thumbs_down::thumbs_down::thumbs_down::thumbs_down:
     
  8. lynnoliver

    lynnoliver Registered User

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    Are the movements in these worth selling on their own? Or is this dumpster material now?
     
  9. lynnoliver

    lynnoliver Registered User

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    For the sake of knowing, could you tell me a bit more about dial restoration, or point me to the appropriate thread/subforum on here so I can read? I'm curious at this point, and satisfying curiosity dulls the dead clock pain. ;)
     
  10. Tom Kloss

    Tom Kloss Registered User
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    Unless there is something special about that particular clock, I'd go for a money refund.

    Tom
     
  11. ClipClock

    ClipClock Registered User
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    #11 ClipClock, Aug 31, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2017
    The movements are very nice quality, do remove it if you get the chance to keep it :)

    I had the exact same thing happen, very similar clock too. I got a local glass printing company to reverse print/etch a dial onto glass (I photoshopped the image from the original). Of course it wasnt as good as the original, but it looked pretty good.

    All things considered though you probably should go for the refund option
     
  12. ClipClock

    ClipClock Registered User
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    Heres a couple of pics of how it turned out. I think they did amend my image for the lettering, but it looked OK so I forgave them lol
     

    Attached Files:

  13. lynnoliver

    lynnoliver Registered User

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    I'm absolutely going for a refund. Total cost, including shipping. That's not in question. If he wants the broken thing back, I'm asking that he pay for return shipping.
     
  14. klokwiz

    klokwiz Registered User
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    This was a nice French cottage clock. the dial was likely glass reverse painted, the case glass can be cut from ordinary window glass. I have repaired several of my own using the broken glass for a template. it is worth fixing yourself if you are handy. If you have all the dial pieces and they are not too small they can be pieced together, not perfect but... there are companies that will make a new one too. Joe
     
  15. lynnoliver

    lynnoliver Registered User

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    Sadly, the dial is the worst kind of thousand piece jigaw puzzle now. :(

    I'm wondering how we can fix the case, too, since the corner that is broken is one of the top corners on the piece with the hanging loop.

    I did find a glass company in town that could possibly cut the case glass for us. The reverse side seems fairly solid, though... do you know how we open it up to put the new glass in without damaging the woodwork?

    Thank you!
     
  16. Dick Feldman

    Dick Feldman Registered User

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    Hello Lynnoliver,

    I have a similar clock belonging to a customer.
    The dial on the one I have is much different than the clock you showed.
    The dial on the clock I have is brass and is engraved with the name "Harry W. M. Watts and Aberdeen." See the attached picture.
    I believe the clock I have originated in Scotland.
    It was common for retailers to attach their company names to clocks, even though someone else made the clock.
    The front of the clock I have hinges at the top of the case. The movement and dial are attached to the rear wall of the clock case. The dial is made from brass plate with crest shaped "shields" marking each hour with Roman Numerals.
    The "front door" is actually two layers of lumber that is held together with screws. The glass is trapped between the two layers of wood. I am sure the glass person you talked to could install the glass in the door.
    If you would like, you can contact me directly at my email address: fourburros@AOL.com or my cell number 970-581-5376
    Best of luck with your clock.

    Dick
    314804.jpg
     

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  17. Kinpol

    Kinpol Registered User

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  18. Bruce Alexander

    Bruce Alexander Registered User
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  19. Kevin W.

    Kevin W. Registered User
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    Time after Time he has a nice web site, wish i understood French.
     
  20. lynnoliver

    lynnoliver Registered User

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    Welp, in case anyone was interested, Etsy washed their hands of it. They don't get involved with what they classify as "damage during shipping."

    Working on another route, but if I CAN'T get my money back.... Suggestions for what to do with it? Do people have hobbies of repairing these things? Could I sell the case and movement to get it out of my house and recoup a portion of what we paid?
     
  21. JTD

    JTD Registered User

    Sep 27, 2005
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    You haven't really shown us the full extent of the damage at the back. The glass in the front is easy to replace - the front should hinge open, there may be a hook or some other little catch at the side. The dial could be restored but would not be cheap. I see no reason why the wooden box at the back could not be repaired without too much trouble (show us a photo).

    You do not say anything about the movement, it would be good to see that too.

    From what I can see, all this could be repaired, it just depends how much you want it done and how much you are are willing to spend.

    And, yes, there are people out there who like to buy 'basket cases' and restore them.

    JTD
     
  22. bruce linde

    bruce linde Technical Admin
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    Dear Person Who Sold Me The Clock And Didn't Pack It Securely Enough To Survive Shipping -

    We made a deal. You agreed to sell me a clock, and I agreed to pay you for the clock and shipping. At the end of the day, you have my money and I have a destroyed clock. I do not believe that I should take the hit on this. I have posted photos of the damage to the clock on the National Association of Watch and Clock Collectors website and asked the people there what to do. No one disputes that the clock was not packaged appropriately for safe shipping... based on their experience shipping hundreds of clocks without damage or injury. No one disputes that the clock could be made to run again... but that that would cost more than what was paid. It's not my fault the clock arrived demolished, and yet I am by default taking sole responsibility? That doesn't seem right to me. I would request (again) that you refund my money, or at least share the pain by refunding half. Do whatever you think is right... but please imagine how you would feel if our positions were reversed.
     
  23. R. Croswell

    R. Croswell Registered User

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    You didn't say whether Etsy or the seller offered you shipping insurance. If you were offered shipping insurance but did not purchase it being compensated may be more difficult. Etsy does have a policy that requires sellers to deliver to the buyer the item that was purchased. You purchased an unbroken clock but received a busted clock so the argument can be made that what you received is not what was paid for. The cost of legal action would be prohibitive but I would at least file a complaint with the Better Business Bureau and any consumer advocate organizations in your state. I would also find out who the CEO of Etsy is and go higher up their chain of command. If nothing else I would have the satisfaction of taking up enough of their valuable time, and their time to answer a BBB complaint to equal what you paid for the clock.

    I wouldn't want to keep that clock or have it "patched up", and I would not accept a partial refund. If you settle with the seller you may lose any legal rights to take any further action. Once you have exhausted all other options I suggest you remove the movement and sell it, but NOT on Etsy! Trash the rest. That's what I would do.

    RC
     
  24. JTD

    JTD Registered User

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    Bruce, I guess you meant to reply to the OP, not to my message?

    JTD
     
  25. lynnoliver

    lynnoliver Registered User

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    The seller didn't purchase insurance, and I was never offered insurance.

    They claimed that since it appeared to be "damaged during shipping," their policies prevent them from doing anything about that. They quite literally said, "Keep working toward a solution together." And since his only evidence that it WAS packed properly is his repeated proclamations to that effect... we're getting nowhere. He's also sent me snotty messages during this process, and somehow gets Etsy's blind eye.

    Thank you. I'm working through the credit card company now to see what can happen. I don't want it in my house either. He said "pls return with no broken bits," whatever that means. If he means "send me a whole clock," he's got a snowball's chance of that ever happening. If he means "clean out the broken glass" I can do that.



    And for the other poster who asked, the case has a broken join on the top left corner. It COULD be repaired, and so far I think the rest of the case is okay, but I haven't touched it or removed all the broken glass yet (still trying to go through the process, didn't want to alter things...yadda yadda).

    And bruce linde, you just wrote what I've been saying on repeat for the last 3 weeks now. Minus the "experience shipping hundreds of clocks" bit. ;)
     
  26. ClipClock

    ClipClock Registered User
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    Tell the seller you're going to parcel it up and send it back (send it tracked and signed for) and on receipt you expect your money back. As they obviously don't feel the damage has effected its value they should have no issue with this.
     
  27. musicguy

    musicguy Moderator
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    If it's only the dial and glass as asked above(and you can't get a refund in the end)
    I would also recommend to fix this clock with a new dial and glass. Everything else
    seems OK. Yes it sucks big time, but if you liked the clock before,
    you can get a replacement dial and glass.

    I sent a clock to someone 8 yrs ago and it arrived
    broken. I felt that I had wrapped it very well, but in the end how it arrived to the buyer
    speaks for itself. I refunded all the money to the person. Sometimes there is miscommunication
    in email between buyer and seller. I think Bruce (above) put together
    a very logical email to send to the seller. Create empathy in your email
    and let them know how you feel in a logical way.

    In the end someone will repair this clock.

    Good luck

    Rob
     
  28. shutterbug

    shutterbug Moderator
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    The software can make things confusing. Depending on what message you are reading when you hit "Reply", the software assumes that you are replying to that particular post, and not just the thread. Hopefully the new MB will correct several issues like this :)
     
  29. JTD

    JTD Registered User

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    That would be good. I always try to click 'reply' on the message I want to answer before I compost the text. That seems to work.

    JTD
     

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