Benedict Brother New York Watch

Discussion in 'European & Other Pocket Watches' started by GD1, Jun 15, 2017.

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  1. GD1

    GD1 Registered User

    Apr 22, 2004
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    #1 GD1, Jun 15, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 16, 2017
    Wondering if anyone can id this movement as to maker and the case mark? Thanks
     
  2. GD1

    GD1 Registered User

    Apr 22, 2004
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    #2 GD1, Jun 15, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 16, 2017
    ...
     
  3. Ethan Lipsig

    Ethan Lipsig Registered User
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    I think it's either a LeCoultre or it's a LeCoultre ebauche likely finished by Agassiz.
     
  4. GD1

    GD1 Registered User

    Apr 22, 2004
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    Thanks. The case looks and feels like gold but the only mark is the eagle.
     
  5. Omexa

    Omexa Registered User

    Feb 28, 2010
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    Hi, it could be Gold; Benedict Brothers New York were a pretty Classy Seller. I have a similar but earlier Case with the Eagle and it is an American Gold Case. Do not get it Acid tested, there are better methods of testing for Gold. Regards Ray
     
  6. GD1

    GD1 Registered User

    Apr 22, 2004
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    Thanks. I picked this up from a retired watch repairman. It runs great and has a decent dial but the seconds post is broken. He had always intended to fix it but it became just another project that never got worked on. Oddly enough the outside of the case was almost black from oxidation and he said it was like that when he got it years before. The inside looked like you see it. The lids are papery thin and I was confused because I didn't think gold would tarnish.
     
  7. MartyR

    MartyR Super Moderator
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    You're right - gold does not tarnish. It may be that the black coating was not oxidisation at all, but maybe a shellac varnish?

    The eagle mark is a known US assay mark for 18K gold, and one that I have found to be trustworthy. But the name of Benedict Bros would be important in determining the reliability of the mark - is the Benedict name inscribed anywhhere on the case?
     
  8. GD1

    GD1 Registered User

    Apr 22, 2004
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    No, only on the movement and dial.
     
  9. MartyR

    MartyR Super Moderator
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    My instinct is that the gold will be 18K, but if that is an important matter to you for reasons of valuation then I would advise that you have the case tested by XRF analyser; these will normally be found only at large pawnbrokers or jewellery stores.
     
  10. GD1

    GD1 Registered User

    Apr 22, 2004
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    Not really, more curious than anything. Obviously the value would be quite a bit higher if gold, but I would hate to see it scrapped. I was actually more interested in who might have made the movement. The case mark was kind of secondary. Been carrying it a little and seems to keep good time. I realize without knowing the service on it, I am sure its hasn't been lately, i wouldn't want to carry it on a regular basis. Thanks to everyone for their help and/or input.
     
  11. GD1

    GD1 Registered User

    Apr 22, 2004
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    I listed this watch on a well known auction site and did not state anywhere in title or description it was gold or even suggested that. Buyer gets it for considerably under gold value, btw I never tested it or had it tested, was just going to let the market decide what it was worth. Buyer files claim, said I misrepresented it as gold, the people in charge made me refund his money and to add insult to injury I had to pay return shipping. Haven't gotten it back yet, figure it will hava big black acid spot on it where he pout 18K acid on it. May still be a low carat case for all I know.
     
  12. MartyR

    MartyR Super Moderator
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    If you choose to use Ebay, you need to be more careful, or you have to be willing to pay the consequences :whistle:

    Of course if you have fully described what has happened, then Ebay/Paypal have both acted illegally, and if you live in the EU you have immediate recourse against Paypal in particular. If your watch arrives with acid marks, you have further legal recourse against Ebay and Paypal and the buyer. But of course you have to be willing to make the effort, and my guess is that you won't ;) So Ebay and Paypal will continue blithely to break the law, and customers will continue to complain ....
     
  13. GD1

    GD1 Registered User

    Apr 22, 2004
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    Everything you say is true. Since I depend on a certain amount of my income on online sales, it's kind of like cutting your nose off to spite your face by going to war. I did send the buyer a message and asked, "If the watch had actually been 18k, would you have sent me more money to offset my ignorance?" Of course, no reply. It does seem like there are more scammers and crybabies out there than I can ever recall dealing with in the past. Sign of the times I suppose.
     
  14. Bryan Eyring

    Bryan Eyring Registered User
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    Item #, please? I like to see additional photos, if you don't mind
     
  15. MrRoundel

    MrRoundel Registered User
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    From the looks of the auction, and how you described the item, Ebay is way out of line. That is Ebay at its worst. I don't see anywhere in the auction where you say its gold. Apparently the buyer gambled on it being 18k, and now wants his stake back since it didn't test to his liking. For Ebay to let them get away with that is unconscionable. This sort of thing is why I'm loathe to sell anything on Ebay these days. Doing so has too strong a tendency to bring more frustration than it's worth.

    Sorry you're having to deal with that garbage. The buyer should be flamed with a negative feedback, but I understand if you're hesitant to do it. I once left a neutral for some jack-mackerel and he retaliated with a negative. I ended my response to his "negative" with "...Feedback system is useless unless it's honest." Frankly, I think the Ebay feedback system offers the tiniest of glimpses into how one might expect to be treated. I GUESS it's better than nothing. Cheers.

    This looks like the auction: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Benedict-Brothers-Pocket-Watch-HC-Swiss-Eagle-Hallmark-Case-Parts-Repair-/172761154225?hash=item28395e02b1%3Ag%3AAbsAAOSwXXxZWXzm&nma=true&si=qN7Wll%252FNidSprnIasvCZk9jZaZ0%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557
     
  16. GD1

    GD1 Registered User

    Apr 22, 2004
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    You're not allowed to give negatives to buyers.
     
  17. GD1

    GD1 Registered User

    Apr 22, 2004
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    I understand someone wanting to get a good deal and being disappointed I've been there myself.I talked to an Ebay representative before I accepted the return and he said I might very well have won the dispute except that my listing showed that I had a 14 day return policy. I said I never had that as a preference and he told me Ebay set it by default if I didn't check my return preferences on every listing. So, basically, flip a coin but it would probably go to his favor.
     
  18. musicguy

    musicguy Registered User
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    Ebay has a learning curve.

    I post very clear descriptions, many photos, and in every listing
    I write in the description, "please look at all the photographs very carefully
    and ask any and all question you have before bidding, because all sales are final
    and I do not take returns." I have never had a problem with any buyers.
    Ebay will always side with you if your listing is not deceptive, and
    all the information is listed.


    Rob
     
  19. MartyR

    MartyR Super Moderator
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    As I said, you have to be very careful on Ebay ;)

    OK, so you accidentally listed a 14-day returns policy ... too bad, you lose, don't do it again :D

    But if the buyer returns it to you with acid marks, you can still refuse to accept the return, and Ebay/Paypal will have to compensate you by paying what the buyer offered to pay. It wouuld be even better if you had pre-mailing photos, but even without those you have an open and shut case because I bet the buyer didn't quote acid marks as a reason for the return! If you want to do this, my strong advice is that when the package arrives, you open it in the presence of someone who will make a credible witness, and if possible video the opening of the package.
     
  20. GD1

    GD1 Registered User

    Apr 22, 2004
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    Well, I read this a little too late. There was a big black acid mark on the eagle inside the case lid but I took simichrome and managed to polish it out. I just gave him his money back and put him on my ever increasing blocked bidder list. Sometimes you just have to move on I guess.
     
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