Ansonia Strike Problem

[Arthur Cagle]

I'm having a problem with the strike on this movement. I've also posted a picture of another identical movement that works correctly (probably because I haven't worked on it, lol) that I've compared it to without discerning any difference in assembly. My problem is that when striking the drop lever isn't dropping into the cam when the countwheel lever passes a deep slot, and I can't find what's preventing it. I'm sure it's staring me in the face but I'm drawing a blank.

 

[Vernon]

Once you assemble the movement with the count lever in a deep slot and the other in the deep part of the cam, it's just a matter of adjusting the warn wheel. That adjustment is made after the movement is back together. Loosen that corner of the movement enough to unmesh the wheel then make the adjustment. Make sure that the springs are let down. You want the stop lever fully down and the pin about a quarter turn away before it advances into the lever.
Vernon

 

[Arthur Cagle]

Once you assemble the movement with the count lever in a deep slot and the other in the deep part of the cam, it's just a matter of adjusting the warn wheel. That adjustment is made after the movement is back together. Loosen that corner of the movement enough to unmesh the wheel then make the adjustment. Make sure that the springs are let down. You want the stop lever fully down and the pin about a quarter turn away before it advances into the lever.
Vernon

Well, I've done that, repeated that, still the same results. That's the same for every countwheel train. That's what has me puzzled.

 

[wow]

Arthur, be sure the pin in the cam is in the center of the slot and the warn pin is about 1/4 inch from the lever like Vernon said. You can check it by slowly turning the warn wheel and watching the warning pin as it locks. When it locks, the other two should still be in the slots. One tooth off can make a difference.

 

[R. Croswell]

... My problem is that when striking the drop lever isn't dropping into the cam when the countwheel lever passes a deep slot, and I can't find what's preventing it. I'm sure it's staring me in the face but I'm drawing a blank.

The count lever blade and the drop lever are attached to the same arbor and move together. Stop the strike train from moving (put a paper clip on the fan) when the drop lever is over the notch in the cam and the count lever blade is at one of the deep slots in the count wheel. If the blade is not lined up with the center of the slot in the count wheel, just bent the lever slightly so that it is. It should then drop into the slot when the drop lever drops into the cam.

If the alignment is off more than slightly, you may need to change the timing between the 2nd. and 3rd. (cam) wheels.

If the count lever blade does line up with a slot in the count wheel and the drop lever is bottomed in the cam, then something is bent and you need to bend the count lever or drop lever so that the count blade is bottomed in the count wheel and the drop lever is substantially (not bottomed) into the cam.

When the count blade is bottomed in the count wheel slot it should more or less point to the center of the winding arbor.

RC

 

[Willie X]

The count finger should be 1/8" above the count wheel when the maintenance lever is riding on the rim of the maintenance disk.

That little gravity lever (in photo #2) can cause some strange problems too. The newer versions have a spring on that lever. Willie X

 

[Arthur Cagle]

Yeah, Willie, I saw that strange little lever mentioned in one of Conover's books, so I paid particular attention to it. It's falling appropriately by gravity, but looks like it could easily jam up if not set properly...kind of flimsy, but it works.

 

[Arthur Cagle]

OK, guys, problem mentioned has been corrected. New problem: Countwheel lever is stopping in every slot, shallow or deep. What do I need to adjust? This should be the last thing before it's ready to reinstall in the Syria case, which I had to hand carve a top for, by the way. Looking forward to finishing this one up, it's been a challenge. As always. the help from all of you is very much appreciated.

 

[Willie X]

How high is the count finger being lifted above the top of the count wheel? Willie X

 

[Arthur Cagle]

How high is the count finger being lifted above the top of the count wheel? Willie X

About 1/8 to 1/4 inch.

 

[Arthur Cagle]

Guys, I'm still puzzled by the problem last stated in post #8. I have a mental blank on this, know it must be one simple adjustment. Can someone help me with this? Really frustrating, I've been futzing with this movement for a month now!

 

[Thomas Sanguigni]

If the countwheel stops in every notch, check the maintenance lever that drops into the strike cam. Willie mentions this above. It may be catching on each revolution and stopping your strike. Recheck your assist spring. These problems can be addressed on your test stand.

 

[R. Croswell]

About 1/8 to 1/4 inch.

"1/8 inch is OK, 1/4 too much.

Guys, I'm still puzzled by the problem last stated in post #8. [ Countwheel lever is stopping in every slot, shallow or deep. ] I have a mental blank on this, know it must be one simple adjustment. Can someone help me with this? Really frustrating, I've been futzing with this movement for a month now!

See the picture below. Run the strike train until the count lever blade drops into one of the "shallow" spaces on the count wheel and stops. Put a paper clip on the fan so it does not move. Locate the stop lever (it will be against the stop pin) and bend it upward slightly just enough so that it does not arrest the stop pin. Remove the paper clip and it should now stop only in the "deep" count wheel slots. Be careful to only bend the stop lever.

RC

 

[Arthur Cagle]

RC, I did as you suggested. It took a couple of tweeks to get the clearance and angle of the stop lever just right, but that got it done! Many thanks to you and all the others who gave me assistance on this movement.

 

[Arthur Cagle]

OK, the movement behaved correctly on the stand for several days. Once I mounted it in the case, it started striking erratically...it would strike correctly, then all of a sudden it would strike up to twenty times. I though the plates might have been slightly racked so I loosened up the case screws a bit to no avail.

Could this be related to the flat lift lever? it's one without the helper spring, and it seems to drop freely. If so, how do I attach the spring to the lever without lever having a spring hook? Or am I barking up the wrong tree...it puzzles me that it worked well on the stand. I went back and read extensive threads on this peculiar lever, and I just don't know what to do next.

 

[Vernon]

Check these: If the fan is too loose, the train will run fast and cause the count hook to bounce up causing the train to continue running. Also, the hook can't touch the sides of the slots as it drops in and pulls out. The hook needs to come straight down and parallel to the side of the slots.

Vernon

 

[Arthur Cagle]

Check these: If the fan is too loose, the train will run fast and cause the count hook to bounce up causing the train to continue running. Also, the hook can't touch the sides of the slots as it drops in and pulls out. The hook needs to come straight down and parallel to the side of the slots.

Vernon

All checks out. It ran fine on the stand, problem arose after mounting in the vase.

 

[R. Croswell]

Did you fully wind the strike train after putting it in the case? sometimes if things are not just right the problem will show wind when the train runs more vigorously. Check again that the count lever blade is centered in EACH OF THE COUNT WHEEL SLOTS. I would suggest that the next step should be to put it back on the test rack and try to duplicate the problem.

I would look for two possibilities.
(1) the lifting lever may be raising the stop lever before the warning lever is in place to catch the stop/warning pin.
(2) The stop lever may not have a full arrest grip on the stop pin. the hook of the stop lever should contact the full diameter of the stop pin.

RC

 

[shutterbug]

I'm guessing the problem will be RC's #2 suggestion.