Age check on 400 day clock

Discussion in '400-Day & Atmos' started by lreyno, Jul 28, 2019.

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  1. lreyno

    lreyno Registered User

    Jan 15, 2017
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    Hi everyone I am just trying to get this clock working for my mother in law and wondered what it’s age was, looking on the internet it says around 1902. But looking in my horolovar 400 day repair book the holes in the back plate look to be in slightly different places, most of them look correct but at least one doesn’t match, it also says to use a .0035” spring, is that correct, any information will be greateful as I am only a novice at these clocks and I know they are difficult to work on.

    Thanks Lee

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  2. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    #2 KurtinSA, Jul 28, 2019
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2019
    Do you have a picture of the pendulum? Also, what type of escapement does it have - pin pallet? Does it have lantern pinions?

    I think this is a clock made by Huber for Badische. Date should be 1911-1914 per notes by John Hubby. Plate 1643 and 0.0035" does seem to be the right spring.

    Same clock:

    ID Badische

    If it is #1643, then maybe the date is more in the 1920s:

    ID a 400 day clock

    Sure seems like someone went to town on bushings...probably was overkill unless it was hammered.

    Kurt
     
  3. lreyno

    lreyno Registered User

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    Hi Kurt thank you for the reply, I will get a picture of the pendulum when I get home at the end of the week, it is a disc pendulum.I am no expert, but I thought that about the bushings, to be honest my mother in law was given this so I don’t have any history of it. I know that when her daughter took it in to a clock repairer they didn’t want to touch it, he said look up above I have lots which I have never got going, so he wasn’t interested in fixing it. That is why I took the challenge on, I got one working once so why can’t I try this one, we have nothing to lose.

    Lee
     
  4. tracerjack

    tracerjack Registered User
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    Love the crown on the Badische clocks. It shouldn't take much to get this one running. I'm still seeing a 90% success rate from just cleaning and replacing the suspension spring on these timepieces. I understand why repair people don't want to work on them, because they can be knocked out of beat so easily. Then, the owners often think they weren't repaired properly. Yours is definitely worthy of a second chance at keeping time. Be sure to report back when you get it running or if you need advice. The bushings probably weren't necessary, but if put in correctly, they wouldn't affect the movement.
     
  5. lreyno

    lreyno Registered User

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    Hi everyone i have now got the clock back together, I have set up the spring to the attached image, it was the closest model I could find on the internet, so hopefully correct. I am having trouble keeping the clock going, I have noticed that the escapement is moving side to side, but the wheel doesn’t seem to move, what could be the issue? I wasn’t sure whether the wheel connected to the mainspring was a little tight in the bushings or not. Sorry I am not using the technical terms but I am still learning. I have tried to attach a video, but it says it’s too large. Also when I slowly move round the minute hand it seems to drop easily from the 2 o’clock. Any help would appreciated.

    Lee

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  6. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    Lee -

    As for the video, it would be best if you could upload it somewhere else like youtube or vimeo. Then post the link to the video.

    If you're saying that when the anchor with pallets rock back and forth, enough so that the escape wheel should be released from the pallets, and it doesn't move, then you have some excess friction either at the escape wheel, or you're getting no power up to the escape wheel.

    Certainly seeing what you're seeing would be helpful.

    Kurt
     
  7. tracerjack

    tracerjack Registered User
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    In reading the previous posts, I can’t tell if you have disassembled the movement and cleaned it. Could you post what you have done to the movement besides attaching the suspension spring.
     
  8. lreyno

    lreyno Registered User

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    Hi I had stripped the movement down but it looked clean, and the oil still looked clean, so at some stage it must have had an overhaul. But looking at the front and back plates, they look like they have been lacquered, I wonder if some of the lacquer may have slightly blocked one of holes. As I say, I think it is the 2nd wheel that feels slightly tight, would that make any difference? I then put it all back together, and put a little oil on the pivots. Now it doesn’t seem like the escapement wheel has enough power to turn. I will try to video it and send it in, but I won’t hold my breath. Do you think I should strip it again and clean it all down properly? This was given to my mother in law by her daughter, which was given to her by someone who she cleans for and had passed away, so I don’t know it’s full history, as you can see from the original pictures it has been rebushed.

    Lee
     
  9. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    Whenever I'm reassembling a clock after cleaning, I put each arbor into its place between the plates and hold the plates or put the screws/pins back in. Then I check that the wheel will spin relatively freely and that there is "end shake"...the arbor can be moved easily back and forth between the two plates. If none of those are seen, then something is wrong. After that exercise with each arbor, I come back and put in each companion arbors in pairs that go up the power train...1st with the 2nd, then 2nd with the 3rd, etc. I then see that moving the arbors relative to each other doesn't create any binding. If you don't fee any tightness doing this, and the two spin somewhat easily, then they're fine. Another thing I do is put all of the arbors except the anchor back between the plates along with the spring barrel and secure the two plates together. Then take the key and see how many clicks it takes to get the escape wheel to start to move. It should move within a few clicks...if it takes 4-5 or more, you have too much binding.

    So, if you aren't getting the escape wheel to turn, then you might need to do some specific checking of the elements of the power train.

    Kurt
     
  10. tracerjack

    tracerjack Registered User
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    I have had movements that were so clean, I didn't have to do much more than peg out the pivot holes and lightly polish the pivots. But, since you suspect power loss or a tight pivot hole, I would do as Kurt suggests. It's time consuming, but worth it. Before you do that, did you take out the mainspring and clean it? A sticky mainspring is going to cause a lot of power loss.
     
  11. lreyno

    lreyno Registered User

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    Thanks Kurt, tracerjack I will try both of your suggestions. I will keep you informed of my progress. Does the image I attached regarding the setting of the spring look right to you both.

    Lee
     
  12. KurtinSA

    KurtinSA Registered User
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    As for the suspension spring, the most critical thing is the right thickness. That will be proven when you get the clock running and you can regulate the clock within the adjustment on the pendulum. As for the spring length, that is more or less set by the clock...it can't be too long as it will hit the base and you don't want it too short...looks goofy. As for the fork position, you need to pick a position and see how the clock runs. Too high on the fork, and the clock might not run due to the power needed. Too low and the clock may flutter. You want the fork to be low without fluttering...that gives you the most over swing with hopefully decent total rotation.

    Kurt
     
  13. lreyno

    lreyno Registered User

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    Thanks Kurt very helpful

    Lee
     

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