A.Willmann & Co Regulators

[tarant]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

I don't know why Dr Watson didn't posted movement's photos. From the secret source (KMZiZ) I have this only one...I think that this clock is from ~1870's...
View attachment 4204

 

[John Hubby]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

Piotr and Ulan, any more photos? This is an interesting clock, would like to see all the parts.

 

[zepernick]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

The gesetzlich geschützt marking (with the u-flyspecks ) brings up two interrelated thoughts. The first concerns dating. The second is what it might have meant, if much of anything.

First, although some of the various German "states" (principalities, grand duchies, kingdoms, etc.) previously had their own laws regarding the protection of Mustern und Modellen, it was a Reich-wide law of 11 January 1876 that led to the widespread use of the marking. Popularly known as Das Geschmacksmustergesetz, the law required a registration of designs (as defined) in a locally maintained registry, a Musterregister.

Secondly, this in turn led to a widespread misuse of the term gesetzlich geschützt, that is, "protected by law." And in turn of this turn, the misuse had two aspects.

As noted in an 1887 article by a well-known patent lawyer, writing in a clockmakers' journal, some manufacturers were marking just about every case model as gesetzlich geschützt. This was much the same in other industries, and there were by then some 200 registrations a day. Although he felt that only about 25% would in fact qualify. The designs were not examined to see if they were truly original, in any case.

For those who might believe that such was only found with lesser firms, I'd suggest a look at the 1883 Lenzkirch catalogue, available in Großuhren 1880 (1985). There were 117 (!) case models marked as having "Musterschutz."

Then there was -- as there still is -- the ambiguity of what exactly was being protected by law when only the term "gesetzlich geschützt" was used.

-- A manufacturer might be claiming that the design of a clock case was in the Musterregister, whether it was or it wasn't.
-- Or he might be implying that a patent had been applied for. Or in fact had been granted.

Courts felt that the public was not able to distinguish which was which, and in law (at least) held the second use to be punishable. This was also later the case with the common use of, say, DRPa, meaning that a proper patent had been applied for.

All said, I'd assume that the stamping on this clock is post-1876. And that we don't know if it was in fact for a design. Or for one that had been registered. Or just tended to blarney. .

Regards
Zepernick

 

[Ulan]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

• You mention there are no marks on the movement other than what appears to be a serial number, so it would be difficult (if not impossible) to say who actually made the movement unless we can find one or more just like it with a maker's stamp. Has anyone here seen anything like this with another identification?
• What shape is the movement? Rectangular, round, or ?? It would be good to see some photos.
• I notice the clock has a balance wheel escapement, is the knob at the upper right on the dial to adjust the timekeeping, or for some other purpose?
• Is there an alarm shutoff on the top of the case, or does the alarm just run down when it sounds at the set time?
• I see four protruding posts at the back cover that seem to be threaded. Did these originally have nuts to hold the back cover in place?
• There are two holes in the dial surround at each side (3:00 and 9:00). Do you have some idea what these were for?

QUOTE]

THX Gents for your feedback.

The clock, when I bought, was in horrible shape and of cause not working.
http://img820.imageshack.us/img820/5628/56040328.jpg
By ulan65 at 2011-10-24

The movement is quite solid and fit into the case without to much empty spaces:
View attachment 4205
By Ulan65 at 2011-11-06
The back cover has wholes, that fit into prolongation of movement's spindles. This spindles are smooth and the cover is kept in position by threaded winding bottoms.

The knob, as John notices, is for timekeeping adjust ( the picture is before restoration, in this shape it was not possible to disassembly the lever)
http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/1440/70039702.jpg
By ulan65 at 2011-11-06

The escapement is cylindirc with 7 jevels ( as I good remember ):
http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/1852/27412496.jpg
By Ulan65 at 2011-11-06

There is no alarm shutoff device, simply ring till spring has power (on the picture you can see the results of someone's ingeration trying to fix broken alarm spring )

Through wholes on 3 and 9 go screws that fix the dial and the movement, I did not put it to the picture.

The clock was worth of my effort ( some picture are before restoration, I did not find betters)

 

[John Hubby]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

The gesetzlich geschützt marking (with the u-flyspecks ) brings up two interrelated thoughts. The first concerns dating. The second is what it might have meant, if much of anything.

First, although some of the various German "states" (principalities, grand duchies, kingdoms, etc.) previously had their own laws regarding the protection of Mustern und Modellen, it was a Reich-wide law of 11 January 1876 that led to the widespread use of the marking. Popularly known as Das Geschmacksmustergesetz, the law required a registration of designs (as defined) in a locally maintained registry, a Musterregister.
<<SNIP>>
All said, I'd assume that the stamping on this clock is post-1876. And that we don't know if it was in fact for a design. Or for one that had been registered. Or just tended to blarney. .

Regards Zepernick

My oopsies for omitting the flyspecks, have corrected that now. The "big" thing however, is your info regarding the 11 January 1876 law as that provides further confirmation of my Gustav Becker data that show their first documented use of the subject term toward the end of 1876. I do have a question: The GB version "as stamped" on the back covers and other places was "GESETZL:GESCHUETZT", evidently using "UE" in lieu of "Ü". Is there some explanation, since this was consistent in all the examples I have recorded? (Photo attached)

Another usage was by Kundo in the late 1920's when they introduced an Art Deco design 400-Day clock that was quite unique and stamped "GES. GESCH." on the back plates of the movements. (Photos attached)

Your last sentence helps explain what makes all this searching so interesting (as well as frustrating) since it is evident that many if not most makers seemed to honor patent, trademark, and registration laws as much in the breech as they did in statement of fact for patents etc. granted (or not). At least we have the "not earlier than" dates to rely on, as for example with the clock being discussed. IF this little fellow was in fact made by Willmann AND the serial number was stamped in the manner of usage followed by Becker (and evidently thus far by AWC/I, remember they were founded by ex-GB employees), then the manufacturing date can be reasonably said to be between 1876 and 1878. This follows from the "not earlier than" for the Gesetzlich Geschützt stamp and a dated Willman in my database from 1879 with serial number 9531.

 

[tarant]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

German "special - additional - letters", a.o "ü" were completely presented as a "standard" (and declared as a source of correct spelling by the Prussian goverment) in 1880 by Konrad Duden in his handbook (first edition in 1872).

Waiting for corrections...

 

[John Hubby]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

Ulan, thanks very much for the additional photos of your clock. You did a marvelous job of restoration and are to be congratulated. You answered my questions very well both with the photos and your response.

Did you do the dial restoration yourself? That would be a real challenge!

Also, I notice the alarm lever "as restored" is shortened so it won't extend outside the dial. I wonder if the original lever had been replaced?

 

[Ulan]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

Did you do the dial restoration yourself? That would be a real challenge!

Yes.
The challange and the case teaches me a lot.
Unusual clock, good to bring it into the life.

 

[soaringjoy]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

John,
regarding international business relations, German industries did
try to avoid the Umlauts (fly specks).
There was, however, no standard of using "geschuetzt", "gesch."
or whatever.
In writing - inside of Germany that is - it would have been an
afront, not to use the Umlauts.
Yes, "the Duden", of course.
A never ending story.
Jurgen

 

[zepernick]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

I do have a question: The GB version "as stamped" on the back covers and other places was "GESETZL:GESCHUETZT", evidently using "UE" in lieu of "Ü". Is there some explanation, since this was consistent in all the examples I have recorded? (Photo attached)

John --

Despite was is often assumed about the Duden influence and the so-called Duden-mentality (i.e. variation in language is not a good thing and some official power should control it), there was in fact and practice variation in when and where what umlaut indications were used. And at that time.

There were 15 possible variations: ä/ae/Ä/Ae/AE, ö/oe/Ö/Oe/OE, and ü/ue/Ü/Ue/UE.

So for example one can find a "rule" that a word with an initial umlaut such as über should not be spelled as Über at the beginning of a sentence. And so it's common to find sentences from the period in which the ü has been represented by Ue. And because it was so often used in titles as concerning/about/in the matter of, it was common in book, article and e.g. dissertation titles (see below).

Then there was the bit about not having any Ä/Ö/Ü when something appeared printed all in uppercase. So we have the formal title of a volume from the Köln (Cologne) library (below) that could otherwise have been written Veröffentlichungen der Stadtbibliothek in Köln /..../ Fünftes und sechstes Heft / . But has Köln(er) elsewhere when it wasn't all in caps.

As a final example (only) there's the bit about names and geographical names and umlauts. Should it be e.g. Ötztaler Straße (or Strasse but never never STRAßE) or Oetztaler? In fact as opposed to opinion the same street near Zepernick showed up with both spellings.

And please note that we're not talking about goodies for the outlandish -- the "if you don't have a ü on your typewriter use ue..." stuff.

Then too, what English speakers often do in practice -- in any and either case -- is simply ignore the umlauts. They might assume that, say, a name that in German is Jürgen would be "Jurgen" . Or take the form "Söhne" and represent it as "Sohne".

Rather -- just sticking to the German of the period for Germans -- there was variation. You also find book titles all in caps in which Ä/Ö/Ü are used (yes, also from Prussia). And you can even look at a PHS catalogue ca 1890 and find PH. HAAS & SÖHNE.

Have spent some time with examples here, as it's not as if only one form appeared in a specific German/German context at the time -- there was variation. And in formal as well as informal contexts.

So you do find (1) different abbreviations of the Gesetzlich Geschützt, including that both "Gs" are usually cap'd and (2) variation in whether that ü in geschützt is represented as ü, ue, Ü, or UE. The second variation (ue) tends to have been less often seen in German German texts (i.e. geschuetzt) but it was also seen.

Yours in flyspecks
Zepernick

P.S. We have so little poetry here on the MB, let alone German poetry, let alone let alone older German poetry about one's Mother who protected one from pain, that one thought it worthwhile to include a poem that also shows variation in that umlaut representation in "geschützt."

 

[soaringjoy]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

Whoa, Zep, hold your horses.
I knew, this would get "complicated"... and the Cologne
city archives are gone anyway; vanished in a subway tunnel.
Thank goodness Willmann has no fly specks on it.
Jurgen

 

[zepernick]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

Sorry, but it didn't get complicated. John asked about the way it was.

Z.

 

[John Hubby]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

Zep, as always a very enjoyable and educational lesson for me and others here on the MB. It appears the vagaries of English must have inherited a lot from German.

 

[soaringjoy]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

Sorry, but it didn't get complicated. John asked about the way it was.

Z.

Perhaps I should explain.
Certainly John "asked" for it and my last post was "meant" to be satiric.
Zep, you have probably already forgotten more about German linguistics
than most native Germans will ever learn.
I know that, no mistake.
At present, we (in Germany) have reached a state of mind of carlessness
in language, due to actually unaccepted new grammar regulations of 2006,
with weary discussions going back to about 1996, as well as a
more or lesser trend of "Germlish".
It's a back and forth process going on with many problems on the sides.
So, these were the first thoughts that came to mind while reading that Umlaut report.
Hope it's clearer now.
Jurgen

 

[zepernick]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

No problem whatsoever .

Indeed, clock-related comments on umlaut-deviation form their own this-is-pretty-weird-stuff sub-genre. And the best example to date relates to the Uhrenfabrik Fürderer Jaegler & Cie, of Neustadt.

For some unknown reason (<-- that the fact) they would commonly stamp their movements as FURDERER JAEGLER&Cie, with very little space between the FURDERER and JAEGLER, and the ie raised etc.

That they didn't use the Ü or a UE -- not to mention that the surname Jaegler is often also spelled Jägler) meant that in a (superb!) 1999 German volume, In die neue Zeit, the author of a section about the firm (Gerd Bender no less) would have to say something.

So attached to an illustration there's the notice that "when a clock was stamped with the 'signature' of the Fürderer Jaegler & Cie firm, the umlaut 'Ü' was replaced by 'U'" -- perhaps with attention to the export market overseas. In order to most authentically represent the signatures, in the descriptions in this chapter this umlaut has also been intentionally done away with."

Knowing that if they just printed FURDERER JAEGLER & Cie in their several captions, someone would want to know what happened to the Ü or UE.

And then you'd have to say, damned if we know.

Zep

 

[Steven Thornberry]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

Knowing that if they just printed FURDERER JAEGLER & Cie in their several captions, someone would want to know what happened to the Ü or UE.

And then you'd have to say, damned if we know.

Zep

So, it really gets us no Furderer along, does it, umlautischerweise?

 

[soaringjoy]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

My saying.
But Steven's right.
Let us get back to the Willmann clocks.
Jurgen

 

[f.webster]

Groose Vienna Regulator??

I have this regulator and I have been searching for the details about it. Well it is at the top of the project list...so here is what I know. It is over the top... I thought I saw a picture once of a very similar clock that was called a Groose Vienna Regulator. The serial number on rear plates is: 5543. The front plate just says 43.

I have attached some images and am asking for help. What, when, where, and how?

Any information and inputs are appreciatated.

 

[tarant]

Re: Groose Vienna Regulator??

Looks like another Albert Willmann (II?) and Co....Could You post the photo of the rear plate ?

 

[Steven Thornberry]

Re: Groose Vienna Regulator??

Just to clear something up (for my own befuddled mind), Groose, or große (or grosse = large)?

 

[Scottie-TX]

Re: Groose Vienna Regulator??

More likely, "Grosse" Regulator - Grosse meaning large, which of course, it is.
Guesstimate Altdeutsch period last quarter, 19th cen.

 

[tarant]

Re: Groose Vienna Regulator??

Or even later. GB produced very similar models to this Willmann in 1912...
(from V Thang again)
PS: Umlauts Strikes Again

 

[f.webster]

Re: Groose Vienna Regulator??

I have attached an image of what is on the back plate. Is that the trademark for Albert Willmann and Co.?

Thank you for the groose translation.

Is there any way to date this monster? What is known aboout the Albert Willmann and Co.? I haven't seen a string titled "Post your Albert Willmann Here".

 

[f.webster]

Re: Groose Vienna Regulator??

Whoa!

Just back from reading treads on The "A. W. & Co" ( I and /or II).

Where does the trademark/stamps put this clock in the midst of that horo-soap?

THanks for the inputs

 

[Ulan]

Re: A.Willmann & Co Regulator

Hello,
I have found the movement ( only). I post it to document. AWC I ? Serial 18037 - close to that one presented by G30071 from first post in the thread.
View attachment 4206
By ulan65 at 2012-01-20
View attachment 4207
By ulan65 at 2012-01-20
View attachment 4208
By ulan65 at 2012-01-20
http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/1371/awc2.jpg
By ulan65 at 2012-01-20

 

[ambodach]

Re: Guidance on Vienna movement cleaning

Very many thanks, guys, for all your comments, support and encouragement. The barrels will be dealt with as recommended.

I can well appreciate the comments about starting off in the clock world with a better quality and more delicate mechanism, but I do have the fall back that I know a professional clockmaker in Edinburgh and if the worst does befall me, I can throw all the bits and a cheque in his direction !! He told me where to start - correct cleaning fluids, etc. but I'm slightly unwilling to take advantage of someone whose income is from repairing clocks and like other forums I'm active on, I like to meet you 'virtual' technologists who all have different opinions but will steer me in the right direction.

The pallets are my main concern as they are certainly worn. What that means as far as the escape wheel is concerned I'm not sure. The pallets are reversible and my instinct is to go that way rather than stone the faces - what by the way is an Arkansas stone? I'm using Laurie Penman's "The Clock Repairer's Handbook" as my guide and will need to fully read, and understand (!), his chapter on deadbeat escapements before tackling this.

What I think I will do is to assemble the mechanism dry and get it assessed by my clockmaker contact for wear on the pivots and holes. It could be that at that point I bail out and let him rebush if necessary.

The biggest problem I find nowadays tackling something like this is the several pair of glasses you have to balance on your nose to be able to see the small holes and the likes. Somewhat different from ones youth when bike hub gear boxes were dismantled in a grubby and poorly lit garage!!

Rob

Edit - meant to include that this is a mechanism from "A. W. & Co" from Freiberg - with a crown stamp.

 

[John Hubby]

Re: Guidance on Vienna movement cleaning

Edit - meant to include that this is a mechanism from "A. W. & Co" from Freiberg - with a crown stamp.

Rob, thanks for that tidbit. Your movement was made by A. Willmann & Co, before mid-1899 and most likely up to several years earlier. If you can post a photo of the movement here or at the very least the movement serial number I will be able to give you an actual manufacturing year as well as other details for identification. I am building a database for Willmann clocks and this one will be another valuable addition to the ones already documented. The fact it is a movement only is no problem, we can match it to others made in the same time frame to give some guidance about what it might have looked like when new and in a case.

 

[ambodach]

Re: Guidance on Vienna movement cleaning

Rob, thanks for that tidbit. Your movement was made by A. Willmann & Co, before mid-1899 and most likely up to several years earlier. If you can post a photo of the movement here or at the very least the movement serial number I will be able to give you an actual manufacturing year as well as other details for identification. I am building a database for Willmann clocks and this one will be another valuable addition to the ones already documented. The fact it is a movement only is no problem, we can match it to others made in the same time frame to give some guidance about what it might have looked like when new and in a case.

Hi John - I'd got most of that info, but any more would be interesting. I bought this movement because it has a particularly pretty face, but I guess that may not have be made by Willman.

Located the photo of the back plate - done the quote and now have to find how to attached the photo! Well that may have been successful. Is there a PM system that you can chase me on if that's not worked ?

Rob

 

[shutterbug]

Re: Guidance on Vienna movement cleaning

Is there a PM system that you can chase me on if that's not worked ?

Sure. Click on the blue name of any member and it will give you options for contacting them.
I took the liberty of rotating your pic for easier viewing

 

[ambodach]

Re: Guidance on Vienna movement cleaning

There's a slight degree of nerves in this project and having done the cleaning, I allowed other things took over for a month or so. Fortunately I took plenty of photos during the dismantlement to help me with the re-assembly. If you are knowledgeable, taking the clock apart, cleaning and reassembling all in one session, then memory I'm sure would have been adequate.

I'm having a failure to find in the two books I have, any guidance on replacing the cords. I've bought new cord, and am assuming that I should put it onto the barrels in the early stages of reassembly (where of course it will get in the way!). I did discover when I took the barrels apart for cleaning that the plate at the opposite end to the gear can be removed - is this necessary for cord replacement or do I knot the cord and then feed it through the hole in the end plate?

And then how long should the cords be? The movement is going to be mounted on a long board (burr elm) rather than a full case, so length is not critical.

Thanks
Rob

 

[ambodach]

Re: Guidance on Vienna movement cleaning

Rob, thanks for that tidbit. Your movement was made by A. Willmann & Co, before mid-1899 and most likely up to several years earlier. If you can post a photo of the movement here or at the very least the movement serial number I will be able to give you an actual manufacturing year as well as other details for identification. I am building a database for Willmann clocks and this one will be another valuable addition to the ones already documented. The fact it is a movement only is no problem, we can match it to others made in the same time frame to give some guidance about what it might have looked like when new and in a case.

Hi John
Did I give you the right information? Am I right in thinking that these clock makers would have made the mechanisms only and that the face and case would have been from other sources ? I think I have a photo of the face somewhere (?) - it's not in the folder of the dismantlement pictures so might take a bit of a hunt to locate, or otherwise it's back into the attic to take a new one if that is of any value.

Rob

 

[prideofmatchingham]

Help Identify This Unmarked Two Weight Vienna Regulator: Lenzkirch?

Greed got the better of me and bought this unmarked Vienna hoping that it may just be a Lenzkirch! There is no mark though, just a number on the back with '5' written below the serial number 75449. Whichever make, seems like an early regulator. Again, there seems faint mark/scratch resembling 4 on the back of the dial. I dont know if its accidental or deliberate.

Any idea on make, model, year? Its 2 weight driven.

POM

 

[prideofmatchingham]

Re: Help Identify This Unmarked Two Weight Vienna Regulator: Lenzkirch?



Here are the remaining pictures which could not get uploaded.

 

[tarant]

Re: Help Identify This Unmarked Two Weight Vienna Regulator: Lenzkirch?

This is not Lenzkirch. That's certain.
This may be a clock made in Freiburg, Willmann probably. Compare with the movement from this thread:

https://mb.nawcc.org/showthread.php?69633-A-Willmann-clock-att-John-Hubby&highlight=willmann

 

[prideofmatchingham]

Re: Help Identify This Unmarked Two Weight Vienna Regulator: Lenzkirch?

Why I thought it may be Lenzkirch was the number 5 below serial number, scratched 4 on back of dial as also the fact that the concentric circle design on the pendulum bob is exactly like one Two weight Lenzkirch which is on auction somewhere.

 

[Sergei]

Re: Help Identify This Unmarked Two Weight Vienna Regulator: Lenzkirch?

Hello
Totally agree with Peter. This is not Lenzkirh.
This is probably a mechanism Willmann & Co.
The second picture of the mechanism can be compared.


Best regards.
Sergei.

 

[prideofmatchingham]

Re: Help Identify This Unmarked Two Weight Vienna Regulator: Lenzkirch?

But no number below the serial number here Sergei.

I was just taken in by that because Lenzkirch had some numbers from 1 to 5 stamped and I thought may be its my lucky day!

 

[Sergei]

Re: Help Identify This Unmarked Two Weight Vienna Regulator: Lenzkirch?

Such numbers for the assembly, and put the other mills, not only Lenzkirh.


Sergei.

 

[Walt Wallgren]

Re: Help Identify This Unmarked Two Weight Vienna Regulator: Lenzkirch?

Hi POM,

At the risk of rekindling a discussion about the elusive Lenzie from several weeks back....

What immediately rules this movement out of the Lenzkirch column are: The anchor bridge is the wrong shape and should be held by only 1 screw on the left side; the plates should be pinned not screwed, the shape of the hammer is wrong, and the hooks on the tops of the weights are also wrong. Weights and hammers can be replaced but when you combine the rest of it, this clock screams not me, not me.

You may want to get a copy of George Everett's book on Lenzkirch. It can help easily eliminate the clocks that don't have a chance of qualifying and can guide through the exacting process of verifying the status of clocks that pass the initial once over.

Walt

 

[prideofmatchingham]

Re: Help Identify This Unmarked Two Weight Vienna Regulator: Lenzkirch?

Thanks Walter for your insightful comment! I did go trhough the thread on Lenzkirch.
So the search continues!

 

[Sergei]

Re: Help Identify This Unmarked Two Weight Vienna Regulator: Lenzkirch?

Hi POM,

The anchor bridge is the wrong shape and should be held by only 1 screw on the left side;
Walt

Not always mechanisms Lenzkirh have such device of the bridge.
Here examples:


Sergey.

 

[tarant]

Re: Help Identify This Unmarked Two Weight Vienna Regulator: Lenzkirch?

But most weight/cable driven had. With exception of precision, jewelled regulators.

 

[Walt Wallgren]

Re: Help Identify This Unmarked Two Weight Vienna Regulator: Lenzkirch?

Not always mechanisms Lenzkirh have such device of the bridge.
Here examples:


Sergey.

Hi Sergey,

You are absolutely correct. The difference is that the examples you provided all have serial numbers well past 1 million and include the trademark on the plate so there is no question as to whether or not it is Lenz. In fact, I have a bracket clock with an identical configuration as in you picture #5. The strict identification guidelines apply to unmarked movements and what history has shown to be the consistency of how things were done in the early days.

Walt

 

[soaringjoy]

Re: Help Identify This Unmarked Two Weight Vienna Regulator: Lenzkirch?

Oh well, oh well!
You just see me laughing - what the heck is soooo important about Lenzkirch or not?
Sometimes it seems to be a matter of life or death... o
Whoever wants to walk on the safe side, this is the motto of the Lenzkircher Uhren-Freunde:
Only a marked Lenzkirch is a Lenzkirch.
Please do consider: After ca. 1850, the Furtwangen School of Clockmaking propagated a "standard"
or "normal" movement of French style, which was instantly adopted by many German producers.
And....these movements look alike, no matter who made them.
So, I could go on and on, even speaking in rhymes, I suppose...

 

[romad10]

A.W. & Co 1/SCHL with Brass Bell base

Since I am completely new to this I figured I would ask folks that know much more about this stuff than I ever could. Found you all on google

We have acquired a clock; looking for information on it if anyone has any information on it. I do have some information on it but I figured I would keep that close hold just to see what other info is out there.

It is a "round" top with with a bell on the bottom. The bell bottom is affixed to a wooden base that is shaped like the bell. The round top has roman Numerals on it for the numbering system. It has 2 arms (hour and minutes) with an arrow pointing counter clockwise.

with the Markings on the Rear of

I will put it in rows at it is on the rear from top to bottom.

A.
W. & Co
FREIBURG 1/SCHL

Then there is a windup on the left rear with GEHWERK
Below the left rear windup it has a N below an arrow pointing clockwise
Then there is a windup on the right rear with WECKER
Below the right rear windup it has a arrow pointing clockwise
Then between the right and left windup it says D.B.R

On the bottom of the back side it has a number of 10XXXX (there are numbers where the X's are but dont want to give out too much info)

It does tick as it appears to function when it is on a level surface.. when it is tilted at all it stops ticking.

Anyone know what year it could have been MFGd?

It appears to be made of Brass , except for the wood base it is sitting on.

It has a bell "dong" on the inside of the bell to bang on the bell when the alarm is set to on.

The leatherman multitool is to show the size of the clock in comparison to the leatherman..

Any help would be great.. thx everyone.

 

[Accujohn]

That's interesting! I believe that's American Waltham, but from some other words might have a foreign or German origin. Clocks are new to me.
Picture of inside movement?

 

[eskmill]

Re: A.W. & Co 1/SCHL with Brass Bell base

Welcome to the NAWCC Message board Romad10 and thank you for the apt description of your alarm clock.

The A. W. & Co., maker of the alarm clock, is one of the many separate small clock manufacturers located in Freiburg, Selisia likely about 1900. Freiburg (free city) is now named Świebodzice, Poland.

 

[romad10]

Re: A.W. & Co 1/SCHL with Brass Bell base

Thx guys for your initial response..

Ill give you some more information on it. It came from Germany originally and has been in my wives family (I met my wife in Germany in 2004, I was stationed in Germany from 1996 to 2007) since the early 1900's (Former East Germany, near Leipzig). My wives father passed away a few weeks ago and it was passed onto her; she just arrived home (Here in USA) early this morning.

Her Great Grandfather passed it to her Grandfather and then to her Father and now to her. It was passed from the first born of each Generation on her Fathers side.

Maybe that would help folks that know more about it now that I narrowed its previous locations.

Thx again guys.. any help would be great.. I am too scared to open it and break it.. the wife would probably unleash her German temper and cuss me out in German

 

[harold bain]

Re: A.W. & Co 1/SCHL with Brass Bell base

The maker is A Willmann & Co. See the listing in Mikrolisk here:
http://www.mikrolisk.de/show.php?site=280#sucheMarker

 

[romad10]

Re: A.W. & Co 1/SCHL with Brass Bell base

Do think think that the marks could be on the inside? i do not see anything on the external anywhere.