New Haven Wall Clock

[Thyme]

Originally Posted by laprade

So how would one remove the numeral. In the past, I have used a scalpel, but not on a plated dial, only on stoved ones. When I said stripper, I assumed that it would be done with a very thin and fine brush. I can't see a big problem.

A: Lacquer thinner or acetone

B: Rubbing compound

[laprade]

I would be more inclined to think that one would have more control over paint stripper and a very fine brush, than thinners or acetone. As to the type of stripper; I'd use a water soluble one, to avoid the spirit based solvents interfering with the lacquer on the surrounding areas.

Generally speaking, stripper only attacks one layer at a time, but in the case of printing ink, it would be more penetrating. Printing ink, being more or less 100% tint, doesn't fade*, like the painted numerals on stoved dials. They use "sign-writer's enamel", which is a one coat paint, no undercoat is used in general sign-writing, as it is virtually impossible to get the registration right. The older sign-writer's enamel very often shows signs of failure. That is why so many L C faces lose their pigment, but not the "3D ghost" which can be seen with reflected light. Enamel and gloss paints are weak in "tint" and prone to failure.

*Some modern printing inks made with substitutes for “lamp black” do fade, and their failure can very often be seen in some road signage.

[Thyme]

Originally Posted by laprade

I would be more inclined to think that one would have more control over paint stripper and a very fine brush, than thinners or acetone. As to the type of stripper; I'd use a water soluble one, to avoid the spirit based solvents interfering with the lacquer on the surrounding areas.

Generally speaking, stripper only attacks one layer at a time, but in the case of printing ink, it would be more penetrating. Printing ink, being more or less 100% tint, doesn't fade*, like the painted numerals on stoved dials. They use "sign-writer's enamel", which is a one coat paint, no undercoat is used in general sign-writing, as it is virtually impossible to get the registration right. The older sign-writer's enamel very often shows signs of failure. That is why so many L C faces lose their pigment, but not the "3D ghost" which can be seen with reflected light. Enamel and gloss paints are weak in "tint" and prone to failure.

*Some modern printing inks made with substitutes for “lamp black” do fade, and their failure can very often be seen in some road signage.

Theoretical knowledge is one thing, experience with what works (practice) is another. Either can be valuable. Success comes with understanding and utilizing both.

[laprade]

Thyme, I'm not exactly sure if you are referring to me possessing only "theoretical knowledge". I can assure you that I painted my first dial in 1975. After trying various other methods, screen printing etc. I chose to use a completely hand done system, and have probably painted, in the intervening 30 years, about over 1000 clock faces. Etched maybe 100, and engraved about 200.

I didn't embark on a career of dial painting by choice. We had so much work, that the normal dial painter was way behind, and since I had some artistic talent, it was suggested that I lent a hand. In fact, to paint numerals on dials, no artistic talent is required. The most enjoyable part of dial painting is doing the moon calendars, where one can exercise one's artistic talent. That talent on my part, is cartoon drawing.

I painted a dial in 79 for a customer, who wanted to buy a large dial clock, but ran out of money, so the clock hung on the studio wall for maybe five years or more, and was packed into a box when, I transferred to Eire. In 91 an antique dealer saw it and asked if it was for sale. When I was dusting it down, I noticed that it had 2 number “1s” and no numeral “XI”.
The scalpel solved the problem.

[Steven Thornberry]

Let's not get into a lengthy and detailed exchange of resumes and qualifications. Keep these discussions offline. We need to stick to the specific topic more closely to be of any help to Mark. Thanks.

[Thyme]

Laprade,

In answering your question I provided you (and the discussion in general) with alternative materials and methods to those you mentioned. Practical experience has shown them to be effective. Despite your cited extensive experience, apparently you were not aware of them. If you had been you would not have queried me about other ways of removing a numeral.

Since you told us your knowledge is so vast, I probably will politely decline to answer future questions from you, lest it spark contentiousness.

[Randyd]

Here's the New Haven Marino dial from my clock.

[swankyman]

That sure is it. Some time if you ever take the face off might you send me a high resolution photo of it. I could do a transfer of it and cover this one for now. Thanks, Mark

[Randyd]

Mark, Sorry I should have said "was" my clock. I sold it on Ebay several months ago. Here is the only other photo of the dial that I have.

Randy

[swankyman]

Thanks for the extra photo. It still will help out.