Ephraim Downes or Downs?

[James Meechie]

Hello,

I have 2, 30 hour Ephraim Downes or Downs transitional WW clocks and was wondering if they were made by the same person? They both are very similar in style and the movements look alike, all be it both having been badly repaired! I realize there is probably about 10 - 20 years difference in their ages, but the labels last names read differently as far as the last names Both these clocks are from Bristol Con. and the labels read the same.

I'm in the middle of cleaning one of the movements (prior repairer installed brass bushing through out) and repairing the case (ugly glue job and seams loose) I will post pictures of both clocks once I'm done.

Cheers,
James

[harold bain]

Hi, James. From a look through Spitters' and Bailey's American Clockmakers and Watchmakers, there were two brothers, Ephram, and Anson Downs in Bristol, Anson listed 1829-30's, and Ephram, 1825-1845. Anson was with Atkins and Downs, 1831-1832. Ephram was connected with George Mitchell. No makers listed under Downes that could be connected with your clocks. Probably a spelling mistake on the label if you have one labelled Downes.

[James Meechie]

Hi Harold,

Thanks for the replyowned the info.
I thought of that but searching the Internet turned up only more confusion for me because I found both names listed on these type of clocks! Here's the intriguing thing, both labels appear to be of the same style. I could buy the mis-spelling if they were listed as the movement supplier by a different manufacturer of the clock case or even listed with as in Mitchell & Downs (es) clocks, but even back then I would have thought one person making and selling a clock under their own name would have ensured the label had their name correct!

Hey, who knows, maybe he was a great movement / case maker and was sadly lacking in the literacy part of his education.

Oh, I also have a letter from the previous original family member / owner ( descendant ) who wrote to the Bristol Conn. Chamber of Commerce back in 1948 asking about Ephraim Downes and they wrote back indicating that Ephraim Downs (yes I know the name changed) was a clock maker from 1822 - 1840. There is also some interest details concerning Downs' life included in the letter. Oh and the really cool part is they also indicated that if he wanted any further info to contact Dudley S. Ingraham, Vice President of the E. Ingraham Company, of this city, who is an excellent authority on old clocks. Sadly, he never wrote Dudley or a response was never kept with this clock.

Cheers,
James

[James Meechie]

Harold,

What i meant to say was "Thanks for the reply and the info." Not "Thanks for the replyowned the info."

Also, I hope I didn't sound rude in my reply earlier, I was just expressing my thoughts on this subject. BTW I was giving your info some thought concerning the two brothers in the same business and wonder if there might have been a, shall we say, falling out between them or disagreement causing one to disassociate himself from the other by loosing or adding the "e"! Again, just some thoughts and really not trying to make something out of something simple.

Cheers,
James

[harold bain]

No problem James. Always fun to speculate when it comes to discrepancies like this one.

[Steven Thornberry]

I suspect it hasn't been too long since spelling conventions were established and consistency built into the spelling of the English language. Heck, I find that the British still get a lot of words wroung!

[James Meechie]

Harold and Steven,

Here is a picture of my clock label as well as the clock itself. I did a searching on the internet and found several examples of both spelling. I believe this clock is an early example of a transitional. I am still a little perplexed as to the spelling and as you pointed out Steven, the convention of spelling may have possibly changed during their lifetime. I actually now own two of these clocks, being offered another one (Downs) that needs some (IMHO major) movement restoration! I'll save this for a later post. Oh, and yes I have the hands for this beauty. Again, according to the seller this clock came from the original faimily.

I am planning on having the tablet restored (water scene) as well as the dial touched up.

Cheers,
James

[Steven Thornberry]

Excellent clock, James! Worth restoring. On the name spelling, I wonder whether there might have been some inconsistency within the Down(e)s family itself?