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Thread: Hide Glue 101

  1. #16

    Default Hide Glue 101 (By: craig)

    Well, maybe I missed it in the post but I'm curious about how to "undo" the glue if there is a problem. It was mentioned that the glue is reversable. How do you do it? Thanks!
    A man with a clock always knows the time. A man with two clocks is never sure.

  2. #17

    Default Hide Glue 101 (By: craig)

    I was told to use a glue that would undo with heat. not pull the wood apart. many glues to day and yesterday will do the same.

  3. #18

    Default Hide Glue 101 (By: craig)

    shutterbug,
    If you need to relocate a re-veneer job, moisture and heat will cause the glue to release. There are various ways: usually a hair dryer will work. If that doesn't, some moisture on the joint will cause the glue to soften. We've got a room humidifier that blows a small stream of steam. It works great. A tea kettle will do the same.

    Hide glue melts around 130 degrees or so. It also releases in contact with water.

    This reversable characteristic is what has facilitated repairs for centuries. Most other glues do not share this same characteristic, and are not used by conservators. Why is that? It's because wood moves with the seasons as the humidity changes. This movement by the wood (called hygroscopic) is what eventually causes joints to fail when environmental conditions are adverse or extreme. Given this fact that wood moves means that a reversible process must be used.

    When I get old, I just hope that the dwindling supply of nice clocks are restored by someone like you who cares enough to ask this question.

  4. #19

    Default Hide Glue 101 (By: craig)

    Hide Glue is also available form Woodcrafters as well.

    It is a nice strong joint once you understand the setting properties. Nice article Craig.

  5. #20

    Default Hide Glue 101 (By: craig)

    Woodcraftes is where I got my story.

  6. #21
    P Schlenker
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    Default Hide Glue 101 (By: craig)

    Craig,

    Excellent post concerning hide glue!

    I was introduced to hot hide glue in the '60s where it was used almost exclusively in all of the woodworking courses at the college I attented. One of my favorite properties of this glue is that you can get maximum joint coverage with minimal "squeeze-out," which is then easily removed after hardening with a sharp wood chisel. And the wood will readily accept a stain on the previously glue covered surface. Very versatile glue!

    You also included some applications that I was NOT aware of -- Thanks for the wealth of info!

    P.S,

  7. #22

    Default Hide Glue 101 (By: craig)

    WHAT GLUE WOULD YOU USE TO GLUE THE WOOD BELLOWS TO THE PLASTIC WHISTLE ??

  8. #23
    Registered user. Scottie-TX's Avatar
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    Default Hide Glue 101 (By: craig)

    For that app. I use contact cement. Easily removeable - bonds well to plastics.

  9. #24

    Default Hide Glue 101 (By: craig)

    Yes, but wouldn't hot hide glue also work? (Just asking.)

    bangster
    1. Check out the Repair Hints & How-To's forum. You may find your answer there.

  10. #25
    Registered user. Chris Radano's Avatar
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    Default Hide Glue 101 (By: craig)

    I do appreciate the accurate restoration process using hide glue. However, I use wood glue in limited quantities. I do not wish to make too much of repairs being reversable. That is why I made the repair!
    I have a Waterbury Regulator #2, which is one of those cases where the case joints have all dried, & deteriorated. The entire case should be taken apart, and reassembled. For this, I would certainly consider the use of hide glue throughout. Some small areas of rosewood veneer are missing from the base, would consider hide glue for repair of this case.

  11. #26
    Forums Administrator harold bain's Avatar
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    Default Hide Glue 101 (By: craig)

    Teaclock, for your bellows question, contact cement was what was originally used on most of these with the plastic base. If it is wood on wood, then hide glue would work.
    Harold
    harold bain, Member ch 33
    "If it won't "tick",
    let me "tock" to it"

  12. #27

    Default Hide Glue 101 (By: craig)

    Thank you about the contact cement, the glue that was used before seemed rubbery.

  13. #28
    Registered User Robert Gary's Avatar
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    Default Hide Glue 101 (By: craig)

    O.K., everybody:

    I just mixed up my first batch of hide glue. Being new to the procedure, I mixed up about 1,000 times more than I needed for my immediate application. I will need more tomorrow, though. Will this batch still be good then? I think I read somewhere on the board that two or three days is fine.

    Am I correct, or should I dump this and start over tomorrow with a new batch?

    I had to buy pearls because that is all I could find at Woodcraft. Their instructions say to add 4 times the volume of water and let it set overnight. That gave me a lumpy, gelatinous mass that wasn't good for anything. So I added more water and heated it all slightly


    Robert G
    Robert Gary "Learn something. Skill does not desert the life of a person ever." Dionysius Cato (ca. 230-150 BC)

  14. #29

    Default Hide Glue 101 (By: craig)

    Robert,
    The pearl-type of hide is more difficult to use because it takes so long to dissolve. But once you get it started, you'll be just fine. I use a grocery store thermometer to monitor the temperature, which should stay between 140 and 150 F. These inexpensive thermometers cost about $6 or so.
    The glue should be fairly thin, and definitely an even consistency. If the stuff gels on you before you are able to get the joints together, not a problem. Just take the parts apart and let the glue gel for about 10 minutes. Then the glue will just roll off, and you can start again.
    The hardest part of hide glue at first is dealing with how it gels. Once it does gel, you should leave the joint undisturbed for several hours until it cures.
    An IR heat lamp of 250W about a foot away and directed at your work will delay the gel process. Thinner glue mixture, and adding 10% urea (available from the same place you got your glue) will definitely delay the onset of the gel process. Just think of it like jello. Once jello sets, you cannot mix it or it just turns into clods. In fact there's more similarities between jello and hide glue than I care to mention here!

    Not too much magic here, just a different way of doing things. Hide glue is as easy to make as jello, and practically the same process to make it.

    Your glue should last maybe a week covered up in the fridge. If you use a glass container, you can just drop the whole thing in 145 F degree water and it will re-liquify.

  15. #30
    Registered User Robert Gary's Avatar
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    Default Hide Glue 101 (By: craig)

    Thank you, Craig.

    RobertG
    Robert Gary "Learn something. Skill does not desert the life of a person ever." Dionysius Cato (ca. 230-150 BC)

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