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  1. #1
    Registered user. Paul Raposo's Avatar
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    Default Need some help with an Illinois transitional

    I picked up this Illinois with plans to resell it. The person I bought it from said the setting needed an adjustment.

    When I wind the movement either with the crown or a key the barrel slips inside the movement.

    When I pull out the setting lever and wind it the hands turn and so does the barrel. If I wind it in the direction to wind the barrel turns and if I wind it backwards the gear train turns.

    The spring isn't broken or slipping as I can feel the arbor turn the spring and it's still attached at the T end.

    The serial number is 700515.

    Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

    Update: Now the hands turn with the setting lever opened and the barrel doesn't move, but it still moves then when setting lever is pushed in.

    I removed the barrel from the movement and spring isn't broken and winds when I use a key on the arbor.

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    Last edited by Paul Raposo; 07-07-2017 at 04:32 PM.

  2. #2
    Registered user. Paul Raposo's Avatar
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    Default Re: Need some help with an Illinois transitional (By: Paul Raposo)

    Looking at the gear train, could the barrel be slipping because the center wheel safety pinion is loose?

  3. #3

    Default Re: Need some help with an Illinois transitional (By: Paul Raposo)

    That is certainly something to check. Probably the first thing to check.

  4. #4
    Registered user. Paul Raposo's Avatar
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    Default Re: Need some help with an Illinois transitional (By: Dave Coatsworth)

    Thank you for posting your comment, Dave.

    I ended up taking the movement apart and sure enough the pinion gear had been twisted off the pinion. Not sure how to proceed.

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  5. #5

    Default Re: Need some help with an Illinois transitional (By: Paul Raposo)

    I think you need a new wheel assembly.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Need some help with an Illinois transitional (By: Dave Coatsworth)

    Check and see if it is friction fit. I know some Rockfords are like that. Just make sure the tab fits into the slot when pressing it on to the arbor.
    Darrah
    Chap. 15, 124, 139, 149, 168

  7. #7
    Registered user. Paul Raposo's Avatar
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    Default Re: Need some help with an Illinois transitional

    Thanks for your reply Darrah. I've noticed the entire pinion is loose within the gear wheel and I don't know if that's normal. Even when the pinion gear is screwed down tight the gear wheel itself turns on the pinion so when I wind it up the barrel is turning the gear rather than being held in place so the mainspring can't wind inside the barrel.

    I think the wheel needs to be staked to sit tight on the pinion but I'm not sure which end to stake down--the side with the pinion gear or the side without the pinion gear.
    Last edited by Paul Raposo; 07-08-2017 at 07:55 AM.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Need some help with an Illinois transitional (By: Paul Raposo)

    The wheel is fine. This Illinois model doesn't have a threaded safety pinion. The pinion locks on with 3/4 of a turn. This pinion has a problem with not staying in place.

    I have successfully fixed many of these with a specific method that works. If I were to mention my method, I would be severely chastised by the purists on this MB.

    Tom

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Need some help with an Illinois transitional (By: Tom Huber)

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Huber View Post
    The wheel is fine. This Illinois model doesn't have a threaded safety pinion. The pinion locks on with 3/4 of a turn. This pinion has a problem with not staying in place.

    I have successfully fixed many of these with a specific method that works. If I were to mention my method, I would be severely chastised by the purists on this MB.

    Tom
    Starts with "s" and ends with "uperglue"?

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Need some help with an Illinois transitional (By: karlmansson)

    Could also start with an "L" and end with a "ock tight"!

  11. #11

    Default Re: Need some help with an Illinois transitional (By: karlmansson)

    Quote Originally Posted by karlmansson View Post
    Starts with "s" and ends with "uperglue"?
    You are correct. I've fixed at least a dozen that the owners told me were unfixable. Just a small drop of superglue where the pinion fits on. screw the pinion on, let it dry and reassemble. The fix will hold the pinion in place, but will break loose if the mainspring breaks.

    The only reason old time watchmakers didn't use superglue is that they didn't have it.

    Tom

  12. #12
    Registered user. Paul Raposo's Avatar
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    Default Re: Need some help with an Illinois transitional (By: Tom Huber)

    What can be done about the loose gear wheel itself? It spins on the pinion even when the pinion gear is screwed down.

  13. #13
    Registered user. Paul Raposo's Avatar
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    Default Re: Need some help with an Illinois transitional (By: Paul Raposo)

    I used the superglue tip and it worked perfectly. The watch now winds and sets correctly and is currently running. Thank you everyone for your help with this

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