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  1. #16
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    Default Re: Setting up Hermle 1161-853 (By: Sam08861)

    Sam, the relationship of part numbers 23 and 24 is wrong, preventing the chime train from locking. Set it up as follows:
    Turn the chime side until 23 is locked by the two hooks.
    Verify that the warning pin is somewhere between 11:00 and 1:00
    Set 24 so that the pin is in the middle of one of the valley's.

    That's all there is to it....should work.
    Dave Diel

  2. #17

    Default Re: Setting up Hermle 1161-853 (By: dad1891)

    I think I'd just arrest the fly when the chime cam enters a valley, then turn the stop lever to where the stop pin is in position to stop the train. Tighten it back down there and you should be good. Alternately, take the chime cam off and let the train run until it stops. That will be the 3/4 hard stop position. Put the cam back on at the 3/4 position and tighten it down. Then use the large wheel on the back side to coordinate the chimes to the cam.
    A man with a clock always knows the time. A man with two clocks is never sure.

  3. #18

    Default Re: Setting up Hermle 1161-853 (By: shutterbug)

    Thank you Dave and shutterbug. I'll try that out this evening as I'm starting to understand a little better how the chime train starts and stops.

  4. #19
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    Default Re: Setting up Hermle 1161-853 (By: shutterbug)

    Wouldn't that change the location of the warning pin?

    Quote Originally Posted by shutterbug View Post
    I think I'd just arrest the fly when the chime cam enters a valley, then turn the stop lever to where the stop pin is in position to stop the train.
    Dave Diel

  5. #20

    Default Re: Setting up Hermle 1161-853 (By: Sam08861)

    1 - Set chime stop pin to stop the train with the warning pin at the 1:00 position.
    2 - Set the chime controll cam with the pin in the center of the gullet.
    3 - Set the ratio gear (on back) so the chime completes as soon as posible to the stop point. Two or three turns of the fly is ideal.
    Note, the 4 shafts extending through the plate (one is on the strike side) should always be cleaned up with a small fine file before assembly to remove the upset metal from the setscrews. You can adjust these setscrews 'just snug' until all adjustments are correct before tightening. This way you will not have to loosen them, just turn against the single snuggled up setscrews.# Test the timing again after tightening. No need to tighten then to much.
    Willie X

  6. #21

    Default Re: Setting up Hermle 1161-853 (By: Willie X)

    Thanks so much everyone!

    Finally got this behaving correctly and ended up trying all 3 methods above making small tweaks to part #23 and 24 until it for all the quarters and hour. Service manual with the chime sequences (page II-14) by song was a big help in getting the ratio gear to the right part of the melody for the relevant quarter.

    Thanks Willie X for the tip on the shafts, I lightly sanded with 2000 grit then cleaned with microfiber cloth with a small amount of oil, then a clean cloth, as I notice the pin for the chime selector sticking.

    Next up is re-installing the geneva stops and getting the timing right. Quick question on the geneva stops as I've seen two approaches:

    1. The 1st to set the stops to prevent overwinding by raising the weights to 3.75" from the bottom of the movement and then putting in the cogs so they can't be wound further, preventing overwind.

    2. The 2nd is to fully unwind, raise to the weights to be just above the floor of the inside of the case and set the cogs so they won't drop any further.

    Is this a matter of preference or is there a 'right' way? Better to prevent overwind or better to prevent losing tension on the cables? Just curious to what everyone's thoughts are.

    I did the 1st method since it was easier, and I didn't want to pull the wheels again to unwind.

    Sam

  7. #22

    Default Re: Setting up Hermle 1161-853 (By: Sam08861)

    I use the first method but the 3.75" measurement is not carved in stone, it can be made different.
    Main thing is that all three weights will stop evenly, or close to evenly, without the weight or pulley hitting anything. I always run the weights all the way up and down a couple of times to check the stops. There should be one full turn of cable left on the drum at the 'all the way down' position.
    Replacing the regular weight/s with a lighter weight, of about 3 to 4 pounds, will make all this testing easier and safer.
    Willie X

  8. #23

    Default Re: Setting up Hermle 1161-853 (By: Willie X)

    I've seen more damage from banging the weights into the seat board than anything else, so I also use the first method. I've only once seen a cable come out of the spool from unwinding too far.
    A man with a clock always knows the time. A man with two clocks is never sure.

  9. #24

    Default Re: Setting up Hermle 1161-853 (By: Sam08861)

    The 'one turn left at the bottom' is also important to keep the cable from stacking at the start of the wind.
    Willie X

  10. #25

    Default Re: Setting up Hermle 1161-853 (By: Willie X)

    Thanks All! I'll double check the bottom stop of the cable drums to make sure they're not hitting the seat board.

    After I last posted, I did have a couple of hours at first where the unit didn't chime on 15/30/45 every other hour, but that seems to have resolved itself now. (looked like the long chime/strike lock lever and auto correction hook wasn't lifting as high) Perhaps due to the auto correction mechanism? Seems to be working now though for the past 10 cycles.

    Final problems are that I was missing a spring on the #7 hammer and replaced it, but the replacement is too strong/big, causing the chime train to bind sometimes when the 7 chime is struck. Putting it on Westminster for the time being is a workaround (since it doesn't use the 7 hammer) until I get the proper replacement spring. (Lost in my workshop, when removing the rear drum/hammer assembly to fix the threads on the chime selector slide set screw, along with several e-clips, lol.)

    Letting it run 24 hours to see if there's any time drift.

    If I can get this running right for a couple of weeks, I'm thinking about getting the auto night shutoff kit that's available for ~10 pounds from a UK seller (Cousins). I haven't found a US seller that has this online. Anyone happen to know if the US stores carry this and it's just not posted due to low demand? Will send some emails this weekend if the movement is behaving before adding to the costs.

    Thanks again to everyone for your responses!

  11. #26

    Default Re: Setting up Hermle 1161-853 (By: Sam08861)

    You'll find that spring as soon as you replace it
    A man with a clock always knows the time. A man with two clocks is never sure.

  12. #27
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    Default Re: Setting up Hermle 1161-853 (By: Sam08861)

    Sam, I sent you a PM.
    Dave Diel

  13. #28

    Default Re: Setting up Hermle 1161-853 (By: dad1891)

    You're not kidding shutterbug! Found 3 e-clips I searched high and low for a year ago from my turntable looking for said spring, lol.

    Dave, thanks so much of the the PM, very helpful!

    Here's the patient, buttoned up and hopefully running smoothly for a bit. The chime / strike weights are lower than the time weight from all the testing.



    I replaced the side black mesh with plexiglass so the movement can be seen like modern clocks. Hoping it's better at keeping dust out too.

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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  14. #29

    Default Re: Setting up Hermle 1161-853 (By: Sam08861)

    I love the open case design. Nice clock!
    A man with a clock always knows the time. A man with two clocks is never sure.

  15. #30

    Default Re: Setting up Hermle 1161-853 (By: shutterbug)

    Thanks shutterbug, was a craigslist 'rescue' and as you predicted, I found that spring! 8 notes on the chimes and all is now working!

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