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  1. #1
    Registered user. pmwas's Avatar
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    Default French made English style verge - what do I have :) ?

    Hi!

    I came across such verge watch recently:





    It looks English, but the movement is French:



    Detalis here:

    http://mb.nawcc.org/entry.php?314-La...ng-verge-watch

    What do I have?
    French watch for English market? English finished French ebauche?
    I was sure it's an English watch buying it - such suprise

  2. #2
    Registered User gmorse's Avatar
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    Default Re: French made English style verge - what do I have :) ? (By: pmwas)

    Hi Paul,

    Almost certainly a French watch in the English style aimed at the latter market. I should think that any English finisher who worked on a piece like this would be drummed out of the Brownies!

    Regards,

    Graham

    "Ut tensio, sic vis" - Robert Hooke

  3. #3
    Registered user. pmwas's Avatar
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    Default Re: French made English style verge - what do I have :) ? (By: gmorse)

    Thanks!
    Looks like the simpliest explanation, yes...
    Like the idiom, never heard that one before

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    Default Re: French made English style verge - what do I have :) ? (By: pmwas)

    it may be that the explanation is simple. this movement is an example of the watchmaking of geneve. that was ancient and renowned as the English one. in photographs two examples of movements made in Geneva, one signed Quartier en Locle 1776-1852 others signed Debrit J L about 1831
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    regards enrico

  5. #5
    Registered user. pmwas's Avatar
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    Default Re: French made English style verge - what do I have :) ?

    The first movement is very similar no doubt...
    I'm pretty sure my both presumed French verge watches are made by the same maker, as they have common, identical features, including very similar plates markings (stamps). Maybe they are both Swiss, then? Or could it be a Locle retailer selling a French movement? It's not getting any simplier now !!!

    p.s.
    notice the English style Fast Slow markings - this movement was meant to look like na English one no doubt.
    Last edited by pmwas; 04-10-2017 at 01:13 PM.

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    Default Re: French made English style verge - what do I have :) ? (By: pmwas)

    Switzerland used Fast Slow for all foreign markets except the German market (who disliked F S) and rarely on the Swedish market
    regards enrico

  7. #7
    Registered user. pmwas's Avatar
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    Default Re: French made English style verge - what do I have :) ?

    Of course, everyone used FS or fast slow.
    Still, the finish of this movement is very English-style.

    Also, the other movement I've mentioned is this one:





    I don't know if you had time to read the blog post:

    http://mb.nawcc.org/entry.php?307-Ol...ance-continued

    ...but in the pictures you'll see this movement is so similar, I'm pretty sure both movements made by the same factory.

    This larger watch has French silver hallmarks (circa 1830), so it was presumed to be French made - possibly Japy Freres.
    If this indeed is French, I think so is the one we're talking about today. If this one, however, is Swiss, I think this earlier one as well...

    It's getting complicated, but surely many movements looking exactly alike this 1830 piece have French signatures, so I think these are French made watches. Or are they ?

    Such a shame the factory did not leave a mark anywhere...

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    Default Re: French made English style verge - what do I have :) ? (By: pmwas)

    seeing the last photo of the blog, I can understand that it is definitely French.
    regards enrico

  9. #9
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    Default Re: French made English style verge - what do I have :) ? (By: eri231)

    I've adjusted the beat, bt even better - running through my parts' box I've noticed a Waltham 1857 (Home Watch Co grade) steel-set cap jewel. It's not like original, but fits much, much better!



    Of course, you see it in a great close-up, in real life it's barely noticable at quick glance now

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    Last edited by pmwas; 04-11-2017 at 06:52 AM.

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    Default Re: French made English style verge - what do I have :) ? (By: pmwas)

    Enrico has mentioned Olivier Quartier. I once had two watches signed by this maker, one in normal Swiss style and the other very similar to the one initially posted by Paul. This item even had the maker's address engraved on the barrel-bridge in 'Old English' script with flourishes around it, very much in the Liverpool manner of the period. And yet that address was not given as Liverpool or London but as Locle; in other words there was no attempt to conceal the Swiss origin of the watch.

    Oliver Mundy.

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