Help! E. Howard pocket watch

[reuben]

Recently my grandfather passed and given to me is his grand fathers pocket watch. I have been searching the web for months useing all the articles and information available, but cant seem to clearly identify this watch. In hope that someone can help me I will do my best to describe its features and markings.

Clock face is roman numerals with e. howard and company boston written in one line, and in some kind of old english text. The face also has a 60 second dial at the bottom. The face opens with a hinge located at the 8 oclock' position.

The back has an engraving that looks like a sheild or royal symbol right in the middle of it. The back case opens with a hinge in the 6 oclock position. Inside the back case the number 6435 is stamped in the lower center.

The second lid in the back case has two holes for the winding key and also is hinged in the 6'oclock position but uses a push tab lock to open it. It also has the numbers 6435 stamped in it.

The works has the name E. Howard co boston engraved in cursive and the number 19179 engraved on the bottom edge. There is also the letter N engraved on the works in cursive. Also there is an a adjusting arm that points down to indicate something between the engraved s and f. There is something else engraved on one of the large gears on the right but it is hidden under the works and I dont want to damage it to see what it is.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thank you.

[reuben]

Recently my grandfather passed and given to me is his grand fathers pocket watch. I have been searching the web for months useing all the articles and information available, but cant seem to clearly identify this watch. In hope that someone can help me I will do my best to describe its features and markings.

Clock face is roman numerals with e. howard and company boston written in one line, and in some kind of old english text. The face also has a 60 second dial at the bottom. The face opens with a hinge located at the 8 oclock' position.

The back has an engraving that looks like a sheild or royal symbol right in the middle of it. The back case opens with a hinge in the 6 oclock position. Inside the back case the number 6435 is stamped in the lower center.

The second lid in the back case has two holes for the winding key and also is hinged in the 6'oclock position but uses a push tab lock to open it. It also has the numbers 6435 stamped in it.

The works has the name E. Howard co boston engraved in cursive and the number 19179 engraved on the bottom edge. There is also the letter N engraved on the works in cursive. Also there is an a adjusting arm that points down to indicate something between the engraved s and f. There is something else engraved on one of the large gears on the right but it is hidden under the works and I dont want to damage it to see what it is.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thank you.

[GD1]

Sounds like a Series 3 keywind made Ca 1868-70. May be the original case but maybe not as a lot of them have been recased. You can get an idea of value by looking at The Complete Guide to Watches by Shugert Engle. They are very nice watches in the original configuration.

[reuben]

More info: I wound the watch a litle so that the gear would run naturally and turn to reveal its markings:

Reed's Pat. Nov 24 1857

Also here is some links to photos of it.

http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/8730/april06008ai0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)


http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/8220/april06012we8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/5024/april06013br1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[Kent]

Hi reuben:

Welcome to the NAWCC Pocket Watch Message Board!

E. Howard & Co. (also known as the E. Howard Watch & Clock Co. (http://static.flickr.com/30/98352686_6e0ccd8a60_o.jpg)) watches were considered to more prestigious than those from the majority of American watch companies. The following is from “E. Howard & Co. Watches 1858-1903”, George E. Townsend, Heart of America Press, Kansas City, MO, 1985 (May be still in print - contact Heart of America Press (http://www.hoapress.com)).

From pages 3 & 4:
Mr. E. Howard made his first "E. Howard & Co." (Boston) movement in 1858 and finished the last ones in 1903.

By this time (1860) E. Howard originated a plan of distinguishing the (watch) size by a letter ... designation (which) is as follows,
N - 18 size
L - 16 size
K - 14 size
J - 12 size
I - 10 size
G - 6 size
These are not standard sizes as compared to rest of the American watch industry (most of which evolved after Howard originated his size system) and they require special-sized cases.

All E. Howard & Co. movements left the factory uncased.

E. Howard was the first American watchmaker to offer movement(s) with a beat of 18000 per hour (a quick beat train). All E. Howard & Co. watches are a quick beat train.

In seeking information about a watch, it is the serial number on the movement (the "works") that is important. Serial number data for E. Howard & Co. watches is available on Dave Chaplain's E. Howard Records Website (http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dchaplain/EH/E_Howard.htm). This has been extracted from original E. Howard factory record books donated to the Smithsonian Institution by Mr. Dana Blackwell, a former employee of the E. Howard Watch Co.

More information on E. Howard & Co. can be found on the NAWCC Chapter 174, Pocket Horology (http://www.pockethorology.org/) website. Additional pictures and more information can be viewed at Howard Pocket Watches 1858-1930 (http://www.oldwatch.com/howard.html).

Good luck,

[Oliver Mundy]

It looks to me as if the case may possibly be authentic. N-size Howards are typically a rather loose fit in 18-size cases; there is often a visible gap between movement and case, and the screw barely makes contact with the lip of the case. Here, although the shadows may be deceptive, it does appear that the movement fits the case quite closely. It would be interesting to know what markings, if any, appear in the case. There is a fairly short list of casemakers who are known to have supplied cases for Howard movements.

Oliver Mundy.

[reuben]

I have examined the case closer with a magnifing glass and have found a bunch more numbers:

On the inside of the back lid:

6435 in the center
also inside the back lid and these numbers are scribed very small by hand, I thought they were scratches at first..

AT 11 O'CLOCK 72793 check mark A4744

AT 9 O'CLOCK 779028

AT 7 O'CLOCK #B514198
AT 7 O'CLOCK IN THE RIM 189

AT 6 O'CLOCK 6162 -JS-

AT 2 O'CLOCK 331

INSIDE WINDER/WORKS LID

IN CENTER STAMPED 6435

AT 7 O'CLOCK 1503 SAMLL CURSIVE G OR CURSIVE CAPITAL J.

HERE IS SOME CASE PHOTOS MY FLASH MAKES THE CASE LOOK WHITE BUT ITS MORE OF A SILVERY GOLD

http://img474.imageshack.us/img474/1453/april06015an5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/4894/april06014ps8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/6923/april06010gs5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[Tom McIntyre]

:smile:Don't use your flash when taking pictures of watches.:smile: <<Unless you have a diffuser.>>