A "typical" 1880s railroad watch

[Greg Frauenhoff]

On the subject of railroad watches, below are some data from an 1889 list of watches in actual railroad service.

Of over 3000 watches, some 538 were Elgins.

Of the Elgins, over 350 were HUNTING 18s movements and at least 70 were 18s PENDANT SET OPEN FACE mvts. Another 79 were 16s (mostly grade 50 convertibles).

In fact, during the 1880s and early 1890s, both Elgin and Waltham made almost all of their 18s open face mvts as pendant setting, including the "railroad grade" ones.

Hopefully, this info is of some educational value.

Greg

[Greg Frauenhoff]

On the subject of railroad watches, below are some data from an 1889 list of watches in actual railroad service.

Of over 3000 watches, some 538 were Elgins.

Of the Elgins, over 350 were HUNTING 18s movements and at least 70 were 18s PENDANT SET OPEN FACE mvts. Another 79 were 16s (mostly grade 50 convertibles).

In fact, during the 1880s and early 1890s, both Elgin and Waltham made almost all of their 18s open face mvts as pendant setting, including the "railroad grade" ones.

Hopefully, this info is of some educational value.

Greg

[John Cote]

Greg,

Here is a photo of a great Elgin Pendant set "RR Grade" watch. Sorry the scan is not my best. It is a 21j grade 150 from the first run of these watches in 1895. I agree that it is a "RR Watch" but whether it is on not it is one of my favorite Elgins. http://www.interstatetime.com/Elgins/Elgin150Mvt.jpg

John Cote http://www.nawcc.org/ubb/eek.gif

[This message has been edited by John Cote (edited 12-13-2000).]

[This message has been edited by John Cote (edited 12-15-2000).]

[Greg Frauenhoff]

Wayne,

20j grade 150 mvts have been seen. I will try to dig out the serial numbers.

Greg

[rrwatch]

This thread sent me scurrying to look at my Elgin Grade 150, S/N 6,457,876. The engraving is identical, (except for the serial number, of course), to John Cotes', but my movement is lever set. Just to make sure, I pulled the dial and the pillar plate number matches. The milling for the lever appears to be original. A brief review of our database shows that S/Ns 6,362,334, 6,457,740 and 7,875,832 were also reported to be lever set.

------------------
Ed Ueberall
NAWCC #49688

[John Cote]

It is interestig to me that some gr.150s from the first run were lever set. I also have a grade 149 hunter, which is lever set. All of the 149s I know about are lever set. I always thought the first lever set 18s open face Elgins were the grade 180/181 which started around SN 7,131,001.

Why, if Elgin had figured out how to make a lever set open face movement when it started producing the gr 150, didn't it make all of the grade lever set? Maybe the market liked the pendant set watch? All I know is that the pendant set is much harder to work on (remember, I am no watch maker).

John Cote

[This message has been edited by John Cote (edited 12-13-2000).]

[Greg Frauenhoff]

John,

The pendant setting feature was evidently a marketing one. It's actually more curious to me as to why it took so long for pendant set hunting mvts to be made. Perhaps, since the lever on a hunting mvt is accessible when the case is opened in the usual fashion, whereas the bezel must be opened on an open face, it wasn't considerd necessary or beneficial?

Greg

[Kent]

Ed and I, with a lot of help from Wayne over the last several days, have been working up a short piece on the 20-J 149's and 150's for the "Updates..." section of the Railroaders' Corner. Does anyone have pictures of 20-J 149's or 150's that we can use?

...John, can we use that image of your 21-J 150?

Thanks,
Kent

[John Cote]

Kent,

Sure you can use the pic of the 150. As I said it was one of my first scans and it isn't of the quality I would like to see. I will probably get around to doing it over after the first of the year.

Here is a pic of my gr149. I have included the dial too because of the thread on "Fleur de Lis" Elgin dials. I can't be absolutly sure, but I really believe this is the original dial for this watch. Maybe the watch wasn't fully assembled and sold until several years after the production date. http://www.interstatetime.com/Elgins/Elgin149Comp.jpg

John Cote

[This message has been edited by John Cote (edited 12-13-2000).]

[Greg Frauenhoff]

Ed, Kent and Wayne,

Here are the serial numbers of two 20j grade 149s that have been reproted to me (I haven't seen them in person so this is hearsay): 6348323 and 63487xx. I saw in person a 20j grade 150 at Florida a few years ago, but didn't record the serial number. I'm still checking for other numbers in my "files" and will report any that might turn up.

I have an ad in my "files" for the new 20j Elgin RR watch. You probably have it already, but let me know if you don't.

Greg

[Kent]

Thanks John!

Now to find some pictures of the 20-J models for comparison, hum!

By the way, I've never seen one of these 20-J models, is it the lower center jewel that isn't there?

Kent

[This message has been edited by Kent (edited 12-14-2000).]