Movement for hunter case or open face ??

[Bill V]

How do I tell if a pocket watch movement is for a hunter case, or for an open face case; or, is there no difference ??

Thanks,

Bill

[rrwatch]

If the movement is key wound and set it makes no difference, as the movement can be rotated 90 degrees to accomodate either case style.
For a stem wound movement, if the winding stem is opposite the seconds bit (that is the seconds bit is at 6 o'clock), the movement is for an open face case. If the winding stem is at right angles to the seconds bit, the movement is for a hunting case.
Brief rule, if the winding stem is at 12o'clock - open face, if its at 3 o'clock, its for a hunter.

[Fred Hansen]

The quickest answer is if the winding stem position is at 3 O'clock it is a hunting case and if at 12 O'clock it is an open face.

The exception I can think of here is for watches that have what are considered "conversion" dials that allow a HC movement to orient correctly in an OF case, or vice versa. These "conversion" dials generally either have no seconds-bit or will have the seconds-bit offset 90 degrees from its usual spot. The movements remain OF or HC, but the dial changes the appearance from the typical rule. Here is a look at a Hamilton watch with one of these type dials ...

http://render2.snapfish.com/render2/is=Yup6ePP%7C%3Dup6RKKt%3AxxrKUp7BHD7KPfrj%3DQofrj 7t%3DzrRfDUX%3AeQaQxg%3Dr%3F87KR6xqpxQQQexoloxaPax v8uOc5xQQQ0JlQQeJanGqpfVtB%3F*KUp7BHSHqqy7XH6gXPGe %7CRup6aQQ%7C/of=50,393,442

To eliminate this exception and judge by looking from the movement side, take a look at where the stem position is and then where the wheel that carries the seconds-hand is. Generally the seconds-hand is carried on the 4th wheel for most watch models. If this wheel is directly across the movement from the stem you have an open-face model, but if it makes a right angle with the center wheel you have a hunting case model.

Keywind watches can be cased in either open face or hunting cases if the winding holes and locating pin holes of the case are correctly oriented.

Fred


Photo added and typos fixed

[Bill V]

rrwatch & Fred,

Thanks for your help.

Bill

[flynwill]

So follow up question: When I find watches on our favorite auction site billed as "sidewinders": Open face watches with the stem at 3, and sub-seconds at 6, are any of these watches "authentic" or have a lot of hunting face movements found their way into open face cases?

[Jon Hanson]

check for the extra case screw marks to see if they have been switched

[LloydB]

So follow up question: When I find watches on our favorite auction site billed as "sidewinders": Open face watches with the stem at 3, and sub-seconds at 6, are any of these watches "authentic" or have a lot of hunting face movements found their way into open face cases?


If you do a search on 'sidewinder' I think you'll find lots
of discussion of these.

The summary (IIRC) is that multitudes of 'hunter'
movements started out in open face cases (ie they
were the original cases.) The reasons are several.

And I've read the opinion that many and perhaps
the majority of sidewinders currently bought and
sold have been recased.

I'd always assume a recase, unless close inspection
suggested otherwise.

[Kent]

flynwill:

When a movement designed to go in a hunting-case (one with a metal lid or cover over the crystal) is placed in an open-face case, the winding stem ends up at the 3 o’clock position. Such combinations are frequently referred to as a “Sidewinder.” Sometimes, this combination was requested by the original buyer when the movement and case were first purchased. As hunting-case watches fell out of favor during the early part of the twentieth century, hunting-case movements, some of them of quite high quality, were offered to dealers at substantial discounts to clear them out of inventory. Dealers placed these in open-face cases in order to sell the high grade watches at attractive prices. Many other sidewinders were created during the depression, and much later during the 1980’s, when gold hunting-cases were scrapped out for the value of the gold, the movements being recased into inexpensive cases. Still other sidewinders were, and continue to be, created by watch collectors and dealers who stripped lower grade movements out of hunting-cases in order to use the cases to house higher grade movements.

Good luck,