Question about the B.W.C.CO. case on the Elgin watches. [Archive] - National Association of Watch and Clock Collectors Message Board

View Full Version : Question about the B.W.C.CO. case on the Elgin watches.

Slon

08-06-2006, 04:57 PM

Hi, I'm new to this forum and to be honest I'm not really the watch collector either. Recently I inherited pocket watch by Elgin in B.W.C.CO. case. After doing some research on internet I found a lot of info on the watch but not the case. I did found the same case on ebay but installed on the Seth Thomas watch:http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=007&it...TRK%3AMESE%3AIT&rd=1 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=007&item=170014138282&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMESE%3AIT&rd=1) The case has same eagle marking and same B.W.C.CO. engraving. Description says that it is made of 8KT gold. I wonder if it is true about gold, and how rare is would be the case like this, and possibly what its value.
Thank you.

Slon

08-06-2006, 04:57 PM

neighmond

08-06-2006, 05:59 PM

It's worth what a willing seller takes from a willing buyer.

How much is my car worth?

Dr. Jon

08-06-2006, 09:56 PM

The Brooklyn Watch Case company developed 8K. IN my experience these cases are unusual but not considered rare.

They often are inscribe also with "Warranted US Assay". They do not include the word "Gold" because US law prohibited calling items at this content level gold.

When they were made they actually cost less than gold filled cases.

As noted,we don't do current values. There is a page in Shugart (Complete Price Guide to Watches) with estimates on watch values which has to be adjusted for varying gold prices.

peg leg

08-06-2006, 10:28 PM

Here is a BWCCO 8K gold with hallmark. Note the 18 is in reference to case size.

Keith R...

http://static.flickr.com/34/100860254_662cc4b753.jpg

Kent

08-07-2006, 08:45 AM

Hi Slon:

Welcome to the NAWCC Pocket Watch Message Board!

The Brooklyn Watch Case Co. (BWCCo.) is discussed in the book, "History of the American Watch Case," Warren H. Niebling, Whitmore Publishing, Philadelphia, PA, 1971 (available on loan by mail to members from the NAWCC Library & Research Center (http://www.nawcc.org/Library/library.htm)). Information on the company has also appeared in an article entitled "The Story of Hayden W. Wheeler," by Howard Lasser, NAWCC Bulletin, October 2005, 549-550. Notes based upon this article will appear in blue. Mr. Niebling describes the firm as starting in New York City in 1865 and moving to Brooklyn (at that time, a separate city, one of the country's largest) in 1866. Hayden W. Wheeler formed the Brooklyn Watch Case Co. on March 10, 1873 to devise methods for the mass production of watch cases. Joseph Fahys was one of the original directors of the company. The company started out by making gold and silver cases, but production of the silver cases eventually ceased. 18-karat and 14-karat cases were made in some quantity prior to the firm moving to Warren St, near Fourth Ave. in Brooklyn. Brooklyn made gold-filled cases, and 14-karat solid gold cases, but is perhaps best known for its line of Eagle solid 8K gold cases. However, Brooklyn offered a Variety of Grades (http://photos7.flickr.com/10756891_df9c6699ac_o.jpg), detailed below. Sometime in the late 1890s or early 1900s, Brooklyn was bought out by Joseph Fahys & Co. a major watch case company who had been listed in Brooklyn ads since 1896 as their selling agent. Joseph Fahys acquired Brooklyn prior to Wheeler's retirement in 1891, by which time the firm was producing 75,000 cases per year. Fahys continued using the Brooklyn name and trade marks.

A pair Brooklyn ads from 1909 give a glimpse into jewelry industry practices at the time. In a January 1909 Ad (http://photos7.flickr.com/10756893_b6ed974853_o.jpg), Brooklyn proclaimed itself the industry leader on account of U.S. government assays showing that Brooklyn used purer gold than its competitors in its 14 kt gold cases, even though all exceeded the requirements of the government's recently enacted stamping law. The fact that none of the case manufacturers' 14 kt gold cases actually assayed at 14.00 fineness or better didn't seem to bother the advertising department who proudly showed it to be 13.92. Perhaps there was some negative comment at the time because an October 1909 Brooklyn Ad (http://photos5.flickr.com/10756894_a8f64370b3_o.jpg) showed that five out of ten case manufacturers' cases assaying at 14.00 or better, with Brooklyn still in the lead at 14.29.

A number of Brooklyn case designs may be seen in an 1898 Brooklyn ad at:
elginwatches.org/scans/misc_ads/1898/m_brooklyn.html
To view, go to the Elgin Watch Collectors Site Home Page at elginwatches.com, then copy and paste the address in your browser's address bar and click on 'Go'.

Brooklyn Gold Case Grades
14K (http://photos17.flickr.com/20253219_f9e50382f8_o.jpg): - - - - 14K solid gold.
Wheat (http://static.flickr.com/28/100192902_22a273039f_o.jpg): - - Double Stock - 14K outer layer, 8K inner layer. Discontinued in 1893 (http://photos6.flickr.com/10756892_e1f7be4ac3_b.jpg).
Granger (http://photos6.flickr.com/10756890_af831f1532_o.jpg): - Double Stock - 14K outer layer, 8K inner layer. Possibly introduced in 1889.
Eagle (http://static.flickr.com/28/100192902_22a273039f_o.jpg): - - - 8K solid gold. Discontinued in mid-to-late1890s.
A1 Eagle (http://photos17.flickr.com/20224485_3535e73e49_o.jpg): - - - 8K solid gold. Introduced in 1898.

Good luck,