Gold plated Bunn Special?

[Fred Hansen]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=975191165

Anyone care to defend this one, dial or movement?

Fred Hansen

[Fred Hansen]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=975191165

Anyone care to defend this one, dial or movement?

Fred Hansen

[Ken Hags]

Fred, I have one of the Gold Plated Bunn Specials. The Gold is much brighter, the winding gears are not plated, etc., etc. Very sad to pay that much for junk.
Ken Hags kalan73897@aol.com

[terry hall]

splish splash I wuz takin a bath....[in plating solution]

I believe we may hear about it upon its arrival..... or not....

[Fred Hansen]

Well the early verdicts are in .... and they aren't looking too good for this one! Now my concern is what happens when someone puts together a better one - one that isn't quite so easy to recognize.

For a rare or valuable watch that is underpriced the "Buy It Now" feature of eBay has come to mean "Now or Never" since enough collectors and dealers view these listings that bargains don't last long.

This is what I imagine happened in this instance. The buyer did not know this particular watch well enough to see the warning signs of this example, but knew that according to the popular price guide the watch was well worth its asking price. Waiting and researching further would mean to potentially miss out.

So what is a collector to do when a watch turns up on eBay as a "Buy It Now", appears to be well underpriced, but falls outside one's particular area of expertise? Turn down the potential find or bargain? Go ahead and bid and take the chance of getting burned? Knowledge is key but few are deeply knowledgeable across all makes and models. Caveat emptor? Any thoughts?

Fred Hansen

[lots of time]

A very good question Fred and a situation I have found myself in a few times. It looked like a good buy, price seemed a bit low in comparison to others of the type. What to do? Sit around and think about it or take a chance on getting burned.
Knowledge is king. Problem is, with modern photography, they can make a mediocre watch look so damn nice!! I have never bought a high grade watch "buy it now" because I dont have enough knowledge or experience yet to keep my chances of getting burned at a minimum.

[Lindell V. Riddle]

Fred,

Greed can be a powerful motivator, often a fast transaction like this is because the buyer really thinks they've snagged a bargain. But not this time!

Ken Hags and Terry Hall called it right, that's a faked up movement. "The Watch Police" (a.k.a. Jon Hanson) mentioned the dial, alas it's just a cheap replacement. For anyone who is uncertain about this type of thing, many of us are glad to "mentor" novice collectors in order to avoid a pitfall like this one. Anyone who puts that kind of money in such a watch will surely regret it... BIG TIME!

Too bad, for about the same money the unsuspecting buyer could have bought a correct example.

Bottom line, another not-so-special Bunn Special!


Lindell V. Riddle

[Ball992B]

Like lots a time said. A fresh buy it now. A low price, what do you do.

The Meat man seems to know his stuff and at 550 it was worth the gamble obviously.

The dial seems too rolled rather than shouldered at the sink. I see this is one of the available replacement variations.

The click sping is plated along with the wheels...?



[This message has been edited by Ball992B (edited 11-02-2002).]

[John Cote]

Lots-of-time makes a good point. Buying certain types of watches on eBay is dangerous. When buying watches, the minute details of which can make drastic differences in value, I want to hold the watch in my hand. Even if you take fraud out of the equation, a photo will never be able to tell me the true condition of a ?mint? case or a ?blazer? movement, and one man?s honest description or interpretation of a watch will invariably be at least a shade different from mine.

Taking fraud into the equation makes the decision to buy on line even more difficult. Some here may remember an 18s Hamilton indicator dial I made up in PhotoShop and posted on the 149 board as an illustration of what could be done. (I am not going to post it again, because I think I rightly took some flack for posting it in the first place.) It looked real, if I do say so myself. This should scare all of us, and make us very careful.

Let the bidder beware!

John Cote
Know when to hold 'em!


[This message has been edited by John Cote (edited 11-02-2002).]

[Jon Hanson]

Fred,

Did you listen to the Hanson Tapp lectures? A few tips on how to avoid this pit were discussed but I guess you missed them.

For the life of me I do NOT understand the concept of temptation to *rip* an item if one doesn't know the subject. IT IS CALLED TAKING A SHOT. Personally, I don't believe in taking shots-never have; I don't in business and I don't in collectibles. IT IS CALLED DISCIPLINE. If you like to gamble, take shots and suffer the consequences; if not, do your homework!

Jon Hanson, nawcc #8801, my 44th year a watch collector

[This message has been edited by Jon Hanson (edited 11-02-2002).]

[terry hall]

i recall an example sold some time ago that was also doubtful as to its heritage, don't recall details though... it had a 'look' about it.... so beware..one may surface from periodically....


terry hall
[jon has been collecting as long as I have been in existance :biggrin:]

[BMW]

Wow! It looks like the fishtrapper done caught him some cod-meat. With that kind of caviar pricing I wouldn't be surprised to see a few more of these gems popping up. When the shark bites...
B

[lots of time]

Exactly my feelings Jon.. I am not about to shell out big bucks for some nice looking "rare" one of a kind, totally origional "buy it now" because of the very reason you give. LACK OF KNOWLEDGE.. I can see even very experienced, knowledgable collectors getting screwed royaly doing this because of a desire to obtian the "rare" or unusual.
There is of course, no subsitute for haveing the watch in hand for examination, before making a decision. What I am endeavoring to do now is gain the knowledge so I know what I am looking for when I have the watch in hand. No subsitute for study.. You HAVE to put the time in.

[Kent]

"To buy, or not to buy?" that is the question!

I put myself in a slightly different position than the questioner supposed. I'm not looking for a bargin, and most of the watches I buy on eBay are not particuarlly high priced, just a bit rare but not normally collected by most railroad watch enthusiasts.

I take chances on such watches whose pictures aren't too clear and for which the answers to my question seems to come from general purpose dealers rather than watch dealers. There's only so many times you can ask for exactly whats marked on the movement. When the answer comes back without mentioning the parts of markings you can see but not read, that's its time to go by experience and take a chance. Or, if I think that its rare enough, I don't wait to ask a question.

"Buy it Now" is great. I just bought one today this way, a 23-jewel, 18-size Zenith Extra. Its the first one I've seen and second that I'd heard about, in 40 years of looking for railroad watches. Most collectors don't even know that they exist (don't bother looking in the popular watch guide book, its not in there).

When I bid on such watches (or order them from mail-order dealers, or even have them in my hands at a mart and buy them), I do so knowing full well that I may be paying far too much for a watch that isn't quite what I thought it was. When it actually turns out that way, I don't look at it as getting stuck (or gyped, or whatever). I consider it to be a new piece of knowledge that cost a bit more than some other pieces of knowledge that I've gained.

Fortunately, more than half the time, I end up with some uncommon railroad watches that were exactly what I thought they were. These were mostly Swiss, made in quantities of a couple thousand or less, some fewer than 100. I don't consider them to be bargins, just watches that, because of their low production, are very, very hard to find.

Kent :smile:

[This message has been edited by Kent (edited 11-02-2002).]

[Greg Frauenhoff]

I for one enjoy "taking a shot" now and then on ebay. Of course, one can't bid stupidly. A while back there was an 18s Rockford listed with no picture. From the info given I was pretty sure (not positive) that it was a model 5 (3/4 plate) with nickel plates. So I bid about what a very average watch of this type would sell for and, low and behold, I won it. When it finally arrived I discovered that it was in an original looking Invisible Hinge coin silver hunting case in very very nice condition with excellent engravings.

Not everything that I've taken a shot at has turned out so well, but if you don't go overboard it can be fun and often pleasantly surprising. I like having a little fun every now and again.

Greg

[lots of time]

Ahhh.. Kent it was you that bought the Zenith!! I was looking at that one, thinking on it, looking some more, considering the buy it now, thinking some more and finally, looked again and it was gone!! I am very glad it went to a good home. I had never seen one before, but saw that it was listed as an approved watch for the CPR in 1899. sometimes he who hesitates is lost. Perhaps I am a bit too overcautious