Hamilton 990

[Jerry Freedman]

For the first time in my watch collecting career, I have run across a Hamilton 990. There does not seem to be much written about this model. Does anyone know where it fits in the Hamilton family and what it's history is? Thanks.

[Jerry Freedman]

For the first time in my watch collecting career, I have run across a Hamilton 990. There does not seem to be much written about this model. Does anyone know where it fits in the Hamilton family and what it's history is? Thanks.

[Kent]

Jerry:

The 990 was introduced at about the same time as the 992, in 1903. It was finished to a slightly higher grade and was fitted with a double roller from the onset. Hence, it sold for a little bit more than the 992. It was a lever-set open-face watch.

Hamilton typically promoted the 990 (http://www.knology.net/~ksinger/990_time_book.jpg) as a factory-cased watch, but it was also available as a movement only. "Hamilton Serial Numbers and Production Figures with Price Guide," Roy Ehrhardt, Heart of America Press, Kansas City, MO, 1981 (A new edition is still in print - see Heart of America Press (http://www.hoapress.com)), indicates that over 16,000 were made between 1903 and 1919.

Kent

[This message has been edited by Kent (edited 06-23-2001).]

[terry hall]

:biggrin:
Ditto to what Kent said.........!

16,489 movements according to one source.
I think in both three and four footed dials, but not 100% on that.

Did these follow the same pattern as other Hamilton movements, ie, the earliest examples NOT being marked with grade number?

[Jerry Freedman]

There is no grade number on the one I am looking at.

[John Cote]

I am not sure that you can say that there is a dividing line between early production without grade markings and later production with. There are certainly marked and un-marked 990s as is the case with other Hamilton grades. I think one could safely say that more later models are marked, but there are early examples of most grades with grade markings, and later examples without.

Maybe Buzz or one of the other Hamilton experts can tell us what Hamilton had in mind with this sort of random grade marking.

JohnCote

[terry hall]

I guess it is possible there could be correlation between the time frame of the ending of the unmarked movements and the changes in the time standards requiring the grade number to be marked on the movement.

[Kent]

I think that there's more than that. Here's the story that I once got from Art Zimmerla:

At some point, Hamilton made the decision that movements wouldn't leave Lancaster without a grade number on them. That meant that all the movements in inventory, which may have been there for several years and were certainly not in any particular serial number order, would be stamped with the grade number prior to shipping.

A sizable number of movements (which had been shipped prior to the decision) were returned to Hamilton (perhaps from distributors who had suffered business failures) and later resold. This is documented in "Hamilton Hand-Written Serial Numbers No. 1 To 824,700, by Col. George E. Townsend," Roy Ehrhardt, Heart of America Press, Kansas City, MO, 2000 (Still in print - see Heart of America Press (http://www.hoapress.com)). These movements would also be out of serial number order with respect to having been stamped with the garde number or not.

Art also said that he believed that if any movement came in for repair (then, as now - I think - Hamilton would accept customer returns for repair) and it lacked a grade number, one would be added prior to returning it to the owner.

It all sounds reasonable!

Kent

P.S. I forgot to mention this above:
I suspect, but I haven't gathered data on it, that changes from 4 dial feet to 3 and 2 winding wheel screws to 1 on the grade 990 follows pretty closely to the serial numbers of the grade 992 where such changes occured. Those serial numbers are published in the June 2001 Bulletin, page 359.

[This message has been edited by Kent (edited 06-23-2001).]

[ckeithjohnson]

Regarding grade markings, I thought I read somewhere that at a point in time ,grade markings were required on watches in order to be RR approved. Maybe I imagined this.

Keith

[Kent]

Keith:

This was true for the Canadian Pacific in 1922. Thanks to Larry Buchan who sent a copy to us, we have:

"Canadian Pacific Railway Co.
Circulars Pertaining to Train Operations
December 15, 1922
Rules Governing the Inspection, Repair, Cleaning, Comparison and Regulation of Standard Watches.

"2. The Standard adopted by the Company are grades of movements that have been approved and listed by the Chief Inspector of Time Service, which are equal to or above Nickel, 17 jewel, Breguet Hair Spring, Patent Micrometric Regulator, Double Roller, Lever Set, Meantime screws and some safety applicances and adjusted to Temperature, Isochronism and at least five positions (the name of the maker, the name of [or?] the number of the Grade and the number of positions it is adjusted to must be stamped on the movement). The variation much not exceed 30 seconds per week."

However, we don't know when the requirement to have the name or number on the movement was first initiated. We have other rules from other railroads, both earlier and later, but none of them mention it. We believe that most railroads required the marking, but we can't document it.

Different watch companies, such as Elgin, South Bend, Rockford and Hamilton seem to have started putting grade numbers on their watches at somewhat different times. In general, I'd say the transition occured during the period between 1906 and 1910. For a comparison, the transition period from single to double roller and from marking the watches "Adjusted" to marking them "Adjusted 5 Positions" seems to have been much sharper from about 1906 to 1908.

Kent

[This message has been edited by Kent (edited 06-24-2001).]

[BUZZ BAZARNICKI]

Jerry,

I concur with Kent's discussion with Art on the marking of Hamilton watches and the story that Art related.

One note,the 990 was/is actually a finer,higher grade watch than the 992. As far as I can tell,even though it(The 990) was produced slightly prior to the 992,they were all fitted with a double roller whereas the early 992's,(In many cases...there are exceptions!) were fitted with single rollers,even though they were both produced at virtually the same time.

In my professional opinion the 990 is a much nicer watch and was produced in far fewer numbers,thus making it a much more desirable and collectible very high grade railroad watch. :biggrin:

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BUZZ BAZARNICKI
ANTIQUARIAN HOROLOGIST
HAMILTON SPECIALIST
MEMBER #120851 NAWCC
PAST V.P.CHAPTER # 52

[Julian Smith]

Just because I read this post, I'm going to get that 990 out of my junkbox and revive it.
J Smith

[Kent]

Julian:

Sounds like a plan! You'll have to post a picture and tell us the details when you're done.

Good luck,
Kent

[Julian Smith]

Kent,
If I could post a picture I'd be the happiest man in the house.
Maybe by the time I get the 990 done I'll know how,and have the right equipment.
J Smith

[Kent]

Julian:

All you need is a flatbed scanner to take a decent scan of a movemetn and to understand Larry Jones' excellent write up on Image Posting (http://www.larjones.com/data/imagehelp.html). Let us know when you want to give it a try and we'll coach you along.

Kent

[Kent]

Oops:

I just came across some 1919 Georgia Railroad time service rules, they too state that:

"All new watches in service ... must show manufacturer's grade, name or number engraved on movement. No watches specially made or named by or for any jeweler will be accepted."

Kent

[BUZZ BAZARNICKI]

Kent,


That should include Ball watches then.. http://www.nawcc.org/ubb/eek.gif ... At least,that's how I read it,since Ball was a private label !!! ... http://www.nawcc.org/ubb/rolleyes.gif

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BUZZ BAZARNICKI
ANTIQUARIAN HOROLOGIST
HAMILTON SPECIALIST
MEMBER #120851 NAWCC
PAST V.P.CHAPTER # 52

[Tom McIntyre]

This is a recurring theme that Ball was a jeweler. Ball had a retail jewelry store, but they were considered a manufacturer, at least in Ball's opinion and presumably in the opinion of the railroads.

There were a large number of watchmakers working for Ball and they had a shop where watches made to their "specification" were received from Hamilton, Waltham and others and taken down for final inspection (to correct error in manufacture :eek :smile: before being sold.

Ball may have had as many people working in their inspection and adjustment department as Hamilton had working in the same functions.

This material was presented at the NAWCC Symposium on Railroad Timekeeping at Rockford several years ago. I don't recall it ever getting published in the bulletin and, at the moment, I don't recall who did the Ball presentation.

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Tom McIntyre
President, NAWCC Chapter 174
Pocket Horology Web (http://www.pocketwatch.org)
Tommy the JOAT's Web (http://www.mcintyre.com/McIntyre)

[BUZZ BAZARNICKI]

If I remember corectly...that was a great thread....Who wrote that? http://www.nawcc.org/ubb/tongue.gif

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BUZZ BAZARNICKI
ANTIQUARIAN HOROLOGIST
HAMILTON SPECIALIST
MEMBER #120851 NAWCC
PAST V.P.CHAPTER # 52